What influences your choice for stem material?

For discussion of fitting and shaping stems, doing inlays, and any other stem-related topic.
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jeff
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What influences your choice for stem material?

Post by jeff »

What are the differences in composition between vulcanite and cumberland rod stock? Are there any functional differences between the two, or are the manufacturing processes and materials so similar that there is no noticable difference, save appearance, between the two?

So, what influences your choice to use either of these materials? Is it simply a matter of asthetics, or are there other factors involved?

Similarly, what would or has cause(d) some of you to use lucite stem material in lieu of vulcanite? I know that I prefer, from a comfortability perspective, the feel of vulcanite to lucite, but I wondered if some of you choose lucite consistently, what has influenced you to make that choice?

I look forward to all of your answers to these questions.

Jeff
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KurtHuhn
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Post by KurtHuhn »

I prefer the feel of acrylic/lucite, so that's what I use when I make myself a pipe, or when I make an experimantal pipe, or when I decide to buy a pipe from another maker.

Vulcanite can be somewhat difficult to come by - especially the *quality* stuff. That drives my use material as well. If I can't get a given material easily, I tend not to use it too much. *HOWEVER*, in this regard I bow to the populace, and use vulcanite far more than acrylic - since vulcanite seems to be the preference of the greater percentage of pipe smokers.

Also, acrylic, in my opinion, is far easier to work than vulcanite. It takes a shine better, and doesn't make a awful mess when you're sanding it - and it doesn't stink to high heaven.
Kurt Huhn
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ToddJohnson
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Post by ToddJohnson »

I only work with German vulcanite because its much more comfortable between the teeth. It also has a degree of elasticity that allows for the bit to be very thin and still very strong. Lucite is too brittle if you're trying to craft a very thin bit with a very open draw. Not to mention that it feels very synthetic and cheap. It gives me the same feeling as when I see plastic children's toys. I guess that for me, lucite has sort of a "made in Taiwan" feel to it.

The only two "drawbacks" are its smell when working with it, and oxidization, both of which are a result of sulpher content. If however, you procure high quality German vulcanite the sulpher content is very low. You can also boil it for a period of time to further remove sulpher content. As far as smell goes, it reminds me of the story I once heard where a guy stops to get gas in a town with a paper mill and asks the clerk "How do you tolerate that smell?" The clerk replies "What smell?" To me, it smells like vulcanite. I only notice it when I've been filing stems with the pipe I'm smoking left sitting nearby. Upon re-lighting it I get a nice whiff and taste of burnt rubber as the little bits of dust get re-lit with the tobacco.

Plus, high grade collectors just don't buy pipes with Lucite stems. I'm sure there are exceptions, in fact I can think of one notable exception, but as a rule they're not too highly regarded.

Todd
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ToddJohnson
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Post by ToddJohnson »

random wrote:I guess Roush is not a maker of high-grades? Seriously, some of his pipes have stems that look to me like acrylic, and people seem to buy them. Yes I do not know what "high-grade" really means.
Larry uses Cumberland, Ebonite, and Bakelite, and yes, most people would call Larry a high-grade maker. I'm speaking in generalities, as I noted in my post. If you want a better example of a high grade maker who uses acrylic try Trever. You never cease to amaze though.

Same leopard, same spots.

TJ
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ToddJohnson
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Post by ToddJohnson »

random wrote:Todd, regarding the "never cease to amaze" stuff, I'm not sure how to take it but it sounds kinda rude.
It means that you're the exact same empty and insulting pseudonym I've known you to be for the last 2 or 3 years. You use self-deprecating rhetoric as a disguise for your arrogance and it's entirely transparent.
It seems like everybody except me knows exactly what a "high-grade" is, if that's the case it's my problem, if not maybe a good topic for the "General" forum?
Nobody knows exactly what a high-grade is, not you and not me. It's been hashed and re-hashed, both on ASP and on KnoxCigar. It's the same discussion that takes place at shows, in newsletters, and in smokeshops. Yes, there are certain things that a "high-grade" must have, but others have criteria in addition to these. Not everybody's are the same. Most of all though, a pipe can't be ugly. If it's crudely wrought and amateurish, it's not a high-grade. Period.
All that I know for sure is that I make the very best pipes I can make, and I've heard that some of the "identifying features" of "high-grades" are polished airways, polished tenon ends, and big prices. Seriously, I think polishing airways and tenon ends is wasted effort because I don't believe it affects smoking characteristics... but maybe that's not why people do it.
A high-grade is much more than a sum of its parts and exceedingly more than a simple smoking instrument as your "I don't believe it affects smoking characteristics" comment would seem to imply. You cannot go down a checklist and say "Polished tenon, tapered draft hole, perfectly aligned airway, yep, I've made a high-grade." It's like saying that you've heard high-end automobiles have keyless entry systems and Dunlop tires, so because your 92 Civic has these features, it must be a luxery car. It's not. It's just an import with a clicker and some aftermarket tires.
Should we talk about it in "General" or shall we simply consider me to be irreperably ignorant?
If you want to search out more ingredients for your high-grade recipe you can always start a new thread. FWIW, I don't doubt that your pipes smoke very well, but finding more spots to polish, tweak, or shine will not make them high-grades. Anyone who told you this has done you a big dis-service.

Todd
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ToddJohnson
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Post by ToddJohnson »

random wrote:Regarding Roush vs Talbert, sorry if you chose to mistake me,


cute . . .
but I distinctly remember seeing a very pretty Roush pipe with a reddish brown swirly colored stem that I thought was acrylic;
Yes, the reddish brown swirly stuff is Cumberland. I've seen a couple hundred Roush pipes in person and have never seen one with an acrylic bit. That doesn't mean he's never made them, but as regards your initial rude and sarcastic question, no Larry is not someone known for using acrylic.
re Talbert I don't recall having seen any of his pipes that screamed "acrylic" mostly the ones I've seen have had black stems which could be anything.
Well by all means, let's base things on what you've seen. It's probably the safest thing since you live on a mountain in Colorado and have never been to a pipe show. Trever is known for using acrylic and for preferring it. He's done pieces in green, tan, orange, gray, yellow, etc. but they could be made from a revolutionary new plastic called Zoltar 9000. Or maybe they were just plastic paintbrush handles.

Todd
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jblock
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Post by jblock »

To me, vulcanite just seems more organic, which is a ridiculous statement, but it feels that way to me more than acrylic.

I much prefer cumberland to ebonite and use it 80 percent of the time but it's harder to come by.

I was under the impression that vulcanite was easier to work with in some respects than acrylic. It's certainly more forgiving when working with it in regards to temperature.
Jonathan
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marks
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Post by marks »

Not trying to stir the pot here, but I think Larry made his early period pipes with acrylic stems. I own six of his pipes, all made in 1991 or earlier, and they all have acrylic stems. I'll have a couple of them with me at the CORPS show in Richmond if anyone would like to inspect them.

I believe that in his his current production, he uses vulcanite, cumberland, and bakelite. He may or may not be using other materials, but I have seen these materials used.

Now back to our regular programming.....
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ToddJohnson
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Post by ToddJohnson »

Some of his gallery pipes say what the stem material is, I don't see that info for this one. Damn me to hell as a sarcastic bastard for thinking that translucent stuff is acrylic.
No Pseudonym, for being a smart-ass not for thinking it's acrylic. Your childish comment was something to the effect of "Oh, so I guess Larry Roush isn't a high-grade pipemaker." I have already said that I'm sure Larry has used acrylic for stems before, but that he's not known as a maker who works in acrylic . . . like Trever for instance. The "reddish swirly material" you referred to is neither red nor swirly. That's tortoise shell, which is a translucent brown, and yes, it's acrylic. Like I said earlier, you're the exact same leopard with the exact same spots.

You want to feel like you're an expert, for others to give you affirmation and tell you your pipes are good . . . but they're not. They should be by now. Heaven knows every pipemaker on the internet has wasted their time trying to give you advice and help you succeed. Most have even ignored your deplorable hubris. But you don't listen, you don't have any respect for established methods that work, and you think your work is superior to those who have established themselves as pipemakers and have stable and loyal customer bases.

You wear a chip around on your shoulder because you're convinced that this is just a huge old boys club that's keeping you on the outside. We've had these exchanges a dozen times before and every time it's the same thing. You say you want to make high-grade pipes, but for 3 years you've tried to change the definition of a "high-grade" to coincide with exactly what you happen to be producing at any given time. You don't want to know what a high-grade is, you just want for someone to tell you that what you're already doing is a high-grade. Well it's not, and until you stop being so obstinate and arrogant you have no hope of producing them. I will leave it at that, Pseudonym. I feel like I have everything out there now. You should take a lesson from the other members on this board, both in decorum and in pipemaking. Is it any wonder to you that those who ask genuine questions here progress at an impressive rate while you putter along in obstinate obscurity?

Todd
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pipemaker
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Post by pipemaker »

ToddJohnson wrote

" You use self-deprecating rhetoric as a disguise for your arrogance and it's entirely transparent. "


I don't see what is wrong with self-defecation. I have been going potty by myself since I was 3 years old.

Mike[/b]
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Post by Gatorade »

gone
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ToddJohnson
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Post by ToddJohnson »

pipemaker wrote:ToddJohnson wrote

" You use self-deprecating rhetoric as a disguise for your arrogance and it's entirely transparent. "


I don't see what is wrong with self-defecation. I have been going potty by myself since I was 3 years old.

Mike[/b]
I was in a local bagel shop a week or so ago and there was this man who looked *exactly* like the reverend Al Sharpton. Apparently the people behind the counter had screwed up his order and after asking for the manager he exclaimed "Your whole staff is incontinent!" I almost crapped my pants!

Todd
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