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PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2017 9:52 am 
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I've read a alot of topics, I've asked some questions before, I think I know what is needed.
I'm sure I know what is NOT going to work: my current 1HP 50L compressor I got for free from my father-in-law.

But my new workshop is nearing completion and I'm on the lookout for a decent compressor to finally do my own blasting, and I came across this one which happens to be on sale:
https://www.hbm-machines.com/producten/ ... ssor-55-pk

In short, it's a Michelin Compressor with:
- 270L tank (71gallons)
- 5.5 HP snare driven motor
- 380V drive
- Max. working pressure of 8 bar (116 psi)
- sucking in 700L/min, delivering a free air of 500L/min (17.6cfm)

And right now it's on sale for €999 instead of €1299.

I'm quite confident this would do the trick and keep up, but I'd like some confirmation from you guys. Most likely, I'll be combining it with a simple blasting cabinet like this one:
https://www.hbm-machines.com/producten/ ... raalcabine

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2017 10:51 am 
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If the CFM of 17.6 is delivered at 116psi, it's entirely adequate for pipe making. If that 17.6 is the rating at 70psi, that's another matter entirely.

The cabinet is less important of a choice than the blast gun and nozzle itself. You need to make sure the gun/nozzle doesn't consume more CFM's at the desired pressure than your compressor can deliver.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2017 11:31 am 
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sandahlpipe wrote:
If the CFM of 17.6 is delivered at 116psi, it's entirely adequate for pipe making. If that 17.6 is the rating at 70psi, that's another matter entirely.

The cabinet is less important of a choice than the blast gun and nozzle itself. You need to make sure the gun/nozzle doesn't consume more CFM's at the desired pressure than your compressor can deliver.


The 17.6 cfm is quite likely the max delivered CFM, but there's no way to find out at what pressure that's measured.
Might be worth mentioning it's a 2-cylinder compressor...

Honestly most higher end compressors I see have slightly lower ratings and cost about double, like this one:
https://www.toolnation.nl/creemers-econ ... -volt.html

Similar specs otherwise, but it only uses 200W less and claims to deliver 15.8 cfm.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2017 11:51 am 
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2 cylinder? Or 2-stage? I presume it's the latter. For what it's worth, I blast at about 120PSI for at least part of the process and my compressor is on the whole time I do that. If I dropped the pressure, it gets a break. I have a 5HP with an 80 gallon tank.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2017 12:10 pm 
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quite sure it's a 2 cylinder single stage... 2 stagers are hard to find and cost as much as a decent used car...

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2017 12:24 pm 
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The 2-stage makes the difference in being able to compress the air to get over 130psi. They are much more efficient.

The way I looked at this was that a good compressor saves time and time is money. I started with a barely capable compressor and got frustrated that it took me an hour to get any texture at all on the pipe. I could forget about craggy. Now I can get a craggy blast in 15 minutes or less. You can make do with an underpowered machine, just know that it will take you longer to get good results. I'm not familiar with European brands and specifications though.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2017 3:33 pm 
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sandahlpipe wrote:
The 2-stage makes the difference in being able to compress the air to get over 130psi. They are much more efficient.

The way I looked at this was that a good compressor saves time and time is money. I started with a barely capable compressor and got frustrated that it took me an hour to get any texture at all on the pipe. I could forget about craggy. Now I can get a craggy blast in 15 minutes or less. You can make do with an underpowered machine, just know that it will take you longer to get good results. I'm not familiar with European brands and specifications though.



An understandable way of looking at it, but not one I can justify as a hobbyist who makes 20-25 pipes a year max. If I can get a good looking blast in about 45min-1 hour I'd be more than happy. The way I have to do it now is drive 30 mins to get to a guy who has a 1hp 100L compressor where it takes me 2-3 hours of mostly waiting to get a lightly textured pipe. I know there's at least a few full timers running on 4hp single stage compressors but I don't know the rest of their set up...

For now I've contacted the shop to see if they can tell me the pressure the 17cfm is measured at and then I might just go and get one. For the price it's a pretty good bargain anyway...

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 20, 2017 8:31 pm 
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Looks like it will do to me. Mine is an Ingersoll-Rand 7.5HP, 2 stage, 220v, 22 max cfm and it blasts quick and kicks on roughly every 5 or 10 minutes at 80-110 psi and catches up fast. Yours will probably run a little more often and take a smidge longer but it should work fine.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2017 3:53 am 
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wdteipen wrote:
Looks like it will do to me. Mine is an Ingersoll-Rand 7.5HP, 2 stage, 220v, 22 max cfm and it blasts quick and kicks on roughly every 5 or 10 minutes at 80-110 psi and catches up fast. Yours will probably run a little more often and take a smidge longer but it should work fine.


Kicks in every 5 or 10 minutes? Heck if the thing can simply keep up while running constantly I'd be more than happy! My new workshop I'm building will be half workshop, half toolshed (lawnmowers & bikes etc), so the compressor will definitely be going on the other side of the 4" insulated wall, blocking out alot of the sound.

sandahlpipe wrote:
If the CFM of 17.6 is delivered at 116psi, it's entirely adequate for pipe making. If that 17.6 is the rating at 70psi, that's another matter entirely.

The cabinet is less important of a choice than the blast gun and nozzle itself. You need to make sure the gun/nozzle doesn't consume more CFM's at the desired pressure than your compressor can deliver.


They just got back to me confirming the 17.6cfm is in fact delivered at 116PSI , so that's good news. Now all I need to do is get the funds together to go and buy one!

edit: funds in check, now just to convince my father-in-law to let me borrow his Audi A6 and trailer so I can go pick up the new gear next week :D

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2017 8:41 am 
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That should be adequate if that's the case. Although you want to be sure of the cfm consumption of the blast gun itself.

Putting the compressor behind an insulated wall is a great idea. I built a closet and insulated it with soundproofing insulation for mine. You can have a conversation while blasting now. My dust collector shares the closet.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2017 10:42 am 
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sandahlpipe wrote:
That should be adequate if that's the case. Although you want to be sure of the cfm consumption of the blast gun itself.

Putting the compressor behind an insulated wall is a great idea. I built a closet and insulated it with soundproofing insulation for mine. You can have a conversation while blasting now. My dust collector shares the closet.


I just put in the order for the cabinet & compressor (and dust extraction and some extras).
The cabinet (and gun that comes with it) are rated for 45-90psi and require minimum 5.2cfm @ 45PSI (I'm guessing that means 10.4 cfm at 90psi?)

Since the cabinet and gun are a Cyclone E-100 lookalike and only cost me €82.5, it's worth trying and getting started with, I can always upgrade later on :-)
Can't tell you how excited I am to start blasting in the véry near future! After I finish the new workshop and supply it with power that is :banghead:

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:04 pm 
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I'm not sure what the formula is to convert the rating @45psi to @90psi. For that matter, I'm not sure there is one. But as you said, you can always upgrade that piece later. I upgraded from the stock gun as well.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2017 7:24 pm 
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Mine is an 80gal 5hp 2 stage like Jerimiaha's I have found that this is the minimum to blast pipes
With any consistency anything less will just aggravate the user. I just saved till I could get this size compressor.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 27, 2017 8:53 am 
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While waiting for delivery I was reading into all the stuff I need to get it set up the best way possible. I came across some other compressors which were 2-stage and kept thinking they look awefully similar constructionwise to the one I ordered.
Then I came accross this PDF by the manufacturer of my compressor:
http://www.fiac.it/wwwfiac/moduli/pdf/p ... chelin.pdf

On page 19 the specs for the compressor I ordered (the MXC 300/525B) are listed and to my surprise I was right: it is in fact a 2-stage compressor,
and on top of that it is actually capable of 145psi, not 116psi; the 116psi is what they use as suggested max working pressure rated at 17.8cfm.
I'm guessing this beast will serve me well for years to come :-)

model: MCX 300/525 B*
V/hz/phase: 400/50/3
tank volue: 270L
air: 525L 17,78CFM
cylinder/ stage: 2/2
max pressure: 10bar 145psi
HP/KW: 5,5/ 4.2


On top of that I realised that the old 1hp compressor I got from my father in law actually has an external in-line moisture trap still connected to it, which I should be able to scavenge for my new setup!

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 27, 2017 9:48 am 
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Massis wrote:
While waiting for delivery I was reading into all the stuff I need to get it set up the best way possible. I came across some other compressors which were 2-stage and kept thinking they look awefully similar constructionwise to the one I ordered.
Then I came accross this PDF by the manufacturer of my compressor:
http://www.fiac.it/wwwfiac/moduli/pdf/p ... chelin.pdf

On page 19 the specs for the compressor I ordered are listed and to my surprise I was right: it is in fact a 2-stage compressor.
On top of that it is actually capable of 145psi, not 116psi; the 116psi is what they use as suggested max working pressure rated at 17.8cfm.
I'm guessing this beast will serve me well for years to come :-)

On top of that I realised that the old 1hp compressor I got from my father in law actually has an external in-line moisture trap still connected to it, which I should be able to scavenge for my new setup!


IF you have room for it, strip the old unit and keep the receiver tank and pipe it into the system. Extra air storage capacity is always good.


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 27, 2017 10:31 am 
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oklahoma red wrote:
Massis wrote:
While waiting for delivery I was reading into all the stuff I need to get it set up the best way possible. I came across some other compressors which were 2-stage and kept thinking they look awefully similar constructionwise to the one I ordered.
Then I came accross this PDF by the manufacturer of my compressor:
http://www.fiac.it/wwwfiac/moduli/pdf/p ... chelin.pdf

On page 19 the specs for the compressor I ordered are listed and to my surprise I was right: it is in fact a 2-stage compressor.
On top of that it is actually capable of 145psi, not 116psi; the 116psi is what they use as suggested max working pressure rated at 17.8cfm.
I'm guessing this beast will serve me well for years to come :-)

On top of that I realised that the old 1hp compressor I got from my father in law actually has an external in-line moisture trap still connected to it, which I should be able to scavenge for my new setup!


IF you have room for it, strip the old unit and keep the receiver tank and pipe it into the system. Extra air storage capacity is always good.


That's something I'm considering, but it might be of more use to me selling it for some extra cash. I won't be blasting more then a few pipes per year for the foreseeable future so expanding the 270L tank to 370L might be slightly overkill for my usage.

Plus I'm storing the compressor & dust extraction on the "garden shed" half of the new workshop, which already limits the amount of space we have left for bikes, garden equipment , etc... Another 100L tank might be pushing it. But right now it's sitting in my current workshop (where it's a PITA), where I can leave it for a while, while I figure out how well the new setup performs.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 27, 2017 12:08 pm 
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Massis wrote:
While waiting for delivery I was reading into all the stuff I need to get it set up the best way possible. I came across some other compressors which were 2-stage and kept thinking they look awefully similar constructionwise to the one I ordered.
Then I came accross this PDF by the manufacturer of my compressor:
http://www.fiac.it/wwwfiac/moduli/pdf/p ... chelin.pdf

On page 19 the specs for the compressor I ordered (the MXC 300/525B) are listed and to my surprise I was right: it is in fact a 2-stage compressor,
and on top of that it is actually capable of 145psi, not 116psi; the 116psi is what they use as suggested max working pressure rated at 17.8cfm.
I'm guessing this beast will serve me well for years to come :-)

model: MCX 300/525 B*
V/hz/phase: 400/50/3
tank volue: 270L
air: 525L 17,78CFM
cylinder/ stage: 2/2
max pressure: 10bar 145psi
HP/KW: 5,5/ 4.2


On top of that I realised that the old 1hp compressor I got from my father in law actually has an external in-line moisture trap still connected to it, which I should be able to scavenge for my new setup!

Certainly sounds like this rig will work for you. I have a 3.5HP single stage 60 gal rig that works well for me, but found it works better with a 1/2" line than the original 3/8" line ( over about 30'). I considered putting an 11 gal accumulator in the line but, like you, I am running out of space and at 100PSI and 12.5 cfu I don't really have to wait for the rig to catch up. I ran out of pipes to sandblast in 2 days while working out the kinks in the system (or in my head).
Now I have to make more pipes to continue to play :D
DocAitch

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 27, 2017 3:38 pm 
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That's the main concern I have left: piping. Both the cabinet and the compressor work with 1/4" by default, so I went with a 1/4" hose for now, but that sounds tiny...

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 28, 2017 7:18 pm 
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The fittings on mine are also 1/4" and I used a 1/2" to 3/8" fitting to step down to my gun.
The resistance in the hose is proportionate to the length and the diameter, the step down does limit the flow, but not as much as a long small diameter hose.
DocAitch

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PostPosted: Tue May 02, 2017 12:50 pm 
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Toys! Lots of Toys!

Image

Image

Image

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