Defining "Danish"

For discussion of the drilling and shaping of the stummel.
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e Markle
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Defining "Danish"

Post by e Markle »

When I first started reading about making pipes I didn't really understand what was meant by the term "Danish" (other than pastries), and I think a working definition would be useful. It seems challenging to define it in a vacuum so I'll try to contrast it with a more classic English school (which, by the way, is what I take to be the root of all modern styles). Below is a first attempt at a definition.

As a general foundation, the Danish Aesthetic (DA) gives more preference to form than to function. That's not to say it excludes function, just that it is an aesthetic, rather than a pragmatic, approach to pipe making. Graceful, flowing yet purposeful lines are the backdrop. I would say English pipes are much more pragmatic; line up two holes with the appropriate amount of briar around them to prevent a burn out and you're on your way to an English pipe. Here are some common characteristics found in the DA:

1. Flowing curves. Again, these are focused and intentional; adding a superfluous line to the stummel isn't really within the DA. The seam or ridge or line on a blowfish is there for a purpose - it creates a break between straight grain and birdseye.
2. The low point on the pipe. The lowest part of the pipe (when held with the rim level-ish) is almost always behind (Tyler, Wayne, NB) the center of the bowl. This isn't true on straight shanked pipes of course, but it is on nearly everything else.
3. A belly. Most of the "classics" made by the Danes will have a more pronounced belly on the bowl. It's usually about a third (or less) of the way up the bowl. Where that falls will vary between makers.
4. Domed or Convex rim. On classics this is fairly universal within the DA. Though you'll notice some are more subtle than others.
5. Forward momentum. This isn't always present, but there is often a more aggressive forward cant than is found on English pipes. Freehand shapes often look like they would fall forward if you set them down on a flat surface or like they were driving at 90 MPH when someone slammed on the brakes.
6. Emphasis on proportion/harmony. Stem length often correlates well with other measurements on the pipe. The visual weight of the shank is balanced by the weight of the bowl. This isn't non-existent in other schools (e.g. the Japanese), but it's more present here than in the English.
7. Emphasis on stem work. Bits tend to be thinner, and more focused on comfort. Some might argue that this isn't really a fair comparison since there isn't a strong tradition of English artisanal pipes, and that's a huge focal point for these smaller makers.
8. Adornments. Other than silver, an occasional piece of horn and a rare amber stem, there isn't much in the way of adornments on English pipes. There are virtually no shank caps or rings and very few inlays in the English school.
9. General attention to detail. Don't get me wrong, a factory producing 10,000 pipes in a few weeks/months mostly does a fantastic job of QC. That said, the overall emphasis there seems to be on volume instead of really high quality. This is really a defining aspect of the DA to me. The perspective is totally different: the focus is on making each pipe to it's highest potential (a Pursuit community, maybe?) vs making a lot of well made pipes (Project community?). The DA doesn't really take efficiency into account (the individual maker certainly does though), because again, the focus is on aesthetics.

No doubt I'm missing some points and need to make modifications, so let's see what we can come up with.
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PremalChheda
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Re: Defining "Danish"

Post by PremalChheda »

Not many Danish pipes have logos on the stems (with exception of the factory made pipes), where the English, American, French, & Italians do.

The shape of the button sometimes is kind of a signature or logo of an artisan pipe nowadays.
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Re: Defining "Danish"

Post by Yak »

Deleted as irrelevant.
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e Markle
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Re: Defining "Danish"

Post by e Markle »

Yak wrote: I keep thinking of Stanwell. Which, within self-imposed limits, managed both.

(IN MY OPINION :lol: )
Maybe so. I guess as a whole, I wouldn't say that Stanwell's average pipe is anywhere near the quality of the average "high grade" Danish, but maybe I'm cherry picking too much. Also, I've only owned one Stanwell, and I haven't studied all that many of them.
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Re: Defining "Danish"

Post by PremalChheda »

Shapes from Stanwell, Dan Pipe, & Larsen all had some shapes that were elegant and flowing like the artisans, but they also had some very English/French looking shapes.
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Re: Defining "Danish"

Post by Yak »

Deleted as irrelevant.
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Re: Defining "Danish"

Post by PremalChheda »

Many of Stanwell's shapes are copies of pipes made by Ivarsson, Eltang, etc.. and were designed by those High grade Artisans, and Stanwell made some darn nice copies, so....

Also, many Larsen and Pipe Dan pipes were actually made by Artisans such as Teddy Knudsen, Tonni Nielsen, Gert Holbek, etc..., so they are up to the quality in a way.
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Re: Defining "Danish"

Post by LatakiaLover »

Larsen made flowing, elegant shapes? Who you trying to kid?

Chunky, square, and thick was practically their trademark:


Image
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Re: Defining "Danish"

Post by NathanA »

I think it would be wise to take factory pipes out of the equation. I am pretty sure that no one here is looking to start a pipe factory. Stanwell is subject to the same downfalls as all pipe factories are when they emphasize quantity rather than quality (and that is not to say that a factory can't produce a quality pipe.) What we all do is make individual, one-off, handmade pipes and therefore it is easiest to look at others operating in the same sphere. I would submit that it is hard to find artisan English pipes because its emphasis on function over aesthetic is not really a school that lends itself to artisan interpretations. I do think that our fellow member Mr. Askwith has done an excellent job of breathing some life in to the English school but pipemakers like him seem to be the exception rather than the rule.

On another note, I think it is great to be an American pipemaker at this time because we don't really have a "school" per se, but rather are able to bring together ideas from other schools and tweak them to make them our own.
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Re: Defining "Danish"

Post by PremalChheda »

There was only one real Artisan that sticks out from the English back in the day - Horry Jameson from GBD, and he made some very elegant Danish looking shapes back in the 1950's around the same time that Sixten and others were creating elegant shapes.
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Re: Defining "Danish"

Post by LatakiaLover »

NathanA wrote:Mr. Askwith has done an excellent job of breathing some life in to the English school but pipemakers like him seem to be the exception rather than the rule.
There's a pragmatic reason for that as much as an artistic one, I think.

Whereas factories just cut 'em and sort the survivors by quality and best finish for that specimen---individual carvers are forced to try to salvage every block possible with creative shaping. And English-y shapes are extremely unforgiving in that regard. Then, the payoff for a significantly higher drop rate is (usually) getting a lower retail price for what gets completed. With a few notable exceptions, people equate price with shaping-related visual "wow factor."
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Sasquatch
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Re: Defining "Danish"

Post by Sasquatch »

Yup. My personal worst on a flawless crosscut "Bing" type billiard was 4 throw-aways before I hit paydirt. That's a real bad bottom-line.

Enter the Sandblast.
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Re: Defining "Danish"

Post by LatakiaLover »

Sasquatch wrote: Enter the Sandblast.

OK:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CD-E-LDc384
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caskwith
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Re: Defining "Danish"

Post by caskwith »

LatakiaLover wrote:
NathanA wrote:Mr. Askwith has done an excellent job of breathing some life in to the English school but pipemakers like him seem to be the exception rather than the rule.
There's a pragmatic reason for that as much as an artistic one, I think.

Whereas factories just cut 'em and sort the survivors by quality and best finish for that specimen---individual carvers are forced to try to salvage every block possible with creative shaping. And English-y shapes are extremely unforgiving in that regard. Then, the payoff for a significantly higher drop rate is (usually) getting a lower retail price for what gets completed. With a few notable exceptions, people equate price with shaping-related visual "wow factor."
Also there is the fact that it is rather futile to compete one on one with the old factories. If someone wants a Classic English made Billiard with a vulcanite stem then they will likely go to Dunhill for that. If they want that Billiard with a pink stem well then they come to me ;)
e Markle
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Re: Defining "Danish"

Post by e Markle »

NathanA wrote:I think it would be wise to take factory pipes out of the equation. I am pretty sure that no one here is looking to start a pipe factory.
Yeah, I struggled with this too; it gets muddy fast. Suffice it to say, I think there's a high correlation between the DA and attention to detail. Let's hear some suggestions on how to address point 9 better.
NathanA wrote: I would submit that it is hard to find artisan English pipes because its emphasis on function over aesthetic is not really a school that lends itself to artisan interpretations.
Yeah, I think this plays a huge role in the above.
NathanA wrote:I do think that our fellow member Mr. Askwith has done an excellent job of breathing some life in to the English school but pipemakers like him seem to be the exception rather than the rule.
He absolutely does. I also see excellent English pipes from Pohlmann, Lindner, Parks and probably others I'm forgetting.
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Re: Defining "Danish"

Post by e Markle »

PremalChheda wrote: The shape of the button sometimes is kind of a signature or logo of an artisan pipe nowadays.
That's an interesting point, Premal.
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Re: Defining "Danish"

Post by The Smoking Yeti »

e Markle wrote:
PremalChheda wrote: The shape of the button sometimes is kind of a signature or logo of an artisan pipe nowadays.
That's an interesting point, Premal.
I need to put some hard work into making my buttons more distinct! :?

I also think stem logos should be more commonplace, they're pretty freakin' cool. Hat tip to Mr. Askwith!

Cheers!

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Re: Defining "Danish"

Post by Yak »

Deleted as irrelevant.
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Re: Defining "Danish"

Post by PremalChheda »

e Markle wrote:
PremalChheda wrote: The shape of the button sometimes is kind of a signature or logo of an artisan pipe nowadays.
That's an interesting point, Premal.
If you look carefully, you will be able to determine who made the stem of any Chheda pipe. Bill's button is a little crisper than mine.
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Re: Defining "Danish"

Post by Charl »

Remarkable! Wonderful stuff, Ernie. Thanks!
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