Help needed with Wood stains!

Cariztian · Post by **Cariztian** » Tue Jan 20, 2009 10:05 am

Hi there all pipecrafters!

I've been circulating this forum for a while now, and it really roxx! hehe

But I would need some help now, concerning my both recent pipes.
Since im new to this i would need some answers to my simple questions

I've been trying to get wood stains here in sweden, and i've read here on the forums that either alcohol-based wood stains, or leather dye would fit our purpose in coloring our precious pipes!

Anyways, i went to the local color store today, and asked for alcohol-based wood stains, and the clerc had NO IDEA about what that is.. but she said they had either OIL-based wood stains, or wood stains containing lacquer..

I bought the oil-based one, and i've coated my pipe with this.. the question is,

WILL this work?
will this also bring out the grain after coating/sanding/coating/careful sanding?

thx

Post by **KurtHuhn** » Tue Jan 20, 2009 10:26 am

The reason alcohol based stains (also called aniline dyes) are used is because they penetrate very well. Same thing with leather dye.

One side effect of oil based stains is that they may leave a residual odor of oil. However, if the stain is allowed to fully cure, this might not be a problem. I will say I have no experience in using oil stains on pipes - I use those for furniture and cabinetry for the most part.

ToddJohnson · Post by **ToddJohnson** » Tue Jan 20, 2009 11:34 am

If you're in Sweden you should be able to find Miller Narsvsvaerte in 100 ml. bottles. I know it's available in Malmo. Here's the address and phone number for the manufacturer if you have trouble.

Flauenskjold A/S . Rebslagervej 1 . 90000 Aalborg.

Tlf. 96 31 47 00

Good luck,

Todd

Cariztian · Post by **Cariztian** » Tue Jan 20, 2009 11:42 am

Thanks Kurt and Todd for your answers!

As i suspected, alcohol would penetrate in to the wood better.. maybe because that stain is thinner then oil based stains?

Well, Narvsvärta is pretty easy to find here!

If i only knew that leather dye translated into Narvsvärta before i purchased this oil-based stain, i sure would have bought that instead! hehe
But ill go for that too! and experiment a bit!

By the way, the oil contained in this stain, is linseed oil... any risk of the oil bursting into flames when smoking the pipe later maybe?

Lets hope not...

/Christian

Frank · Post by **Frank** » Tue Jan 20, 2009 2:58 pm

If you still have problems obtaining the premixed stain, you can make your own using powdered pigment soluble in denatured alcohol (in the UK it's called methylated spirits, don't know what it's called in Sweden).

This website might also be of interest to you: http://www.svenskapipklubben.se/default.asp?lang=3

Cariztian · Post by **Cariztian** » Tue Jan 20, 2009 4:58 pm

Hello all!

Hey Frank, could Denaturated Alcohol maybe translate as T-röd? (T-red in english)

Its a a composition of ethanol, methylethylketon, aceton, ethylacetate and bitrex.

It says in swedish Wikipedia that it is a 95% Denaturated Alcohol, so i guess it would fit that purpose!! =)

And about pigments..
I got organic pigments, both red, blue and yellow..
(powdered, and its a PAIN in the a** to remove from metals/clothes and so on..^^ havent tried it yet for wood)

Would those work as for coloring??

Thx!

geigerpipes · Post by **geigerpipes** » Tue Jan 20, 2009 5:24 pm

Hey Cariztian

Im in sweden and pretty much know where to get most of the stuff you need for pipemaking.

Heres a good place to get narvsvärta :

http://nordellknives.com/indexS.shtml

Look under "läderbehandling" there's also other usable stuff for pipemakers there...

T-röd works just be carefull not to spill any into the tobacco chamber, but you stain need to be able to mix with alcohol... you cannot find any local powdered analine based stain here anymore, there is herdins äkta bets available in most hardware stores but its not that good..

Look feel free to give me a call for advice our tel. number is on our contact page on our site

Frank · Post by **Frank** » Tue Jan 20, 2009 5:48 pm

Cariztian, Love Geiger is one of the top professional pipemakers and can advise you far better than I can. With him to advise you, you're in very good hands.

Cariztian · Post by **Cariztian** » Tue Jan 20, 2009 6:01 pm

Hi Geiger!

I was looking at your site.. and all i can say is .. WOW.. really amazing work there!

(Finare pipor kan man nog inte hitta!)

I ordered my Briar from jano-knives.com, not as grainy as your blocks displayed on your site/this site, but still very good blocks and it has birds eyes too!

I noticed now, when speaking about Narvsvärta, that JanO had that too!

Too bad i didnt know before ordering Karanuba + the briar ! =(

By the way, the oil-based stain did NOT penetrate well, mostly in the grain, but most of it was easily sanded away!

Humm.. ill try mixing the organic pigments and ill take a look how well it works!

Thx alot!
/Christian

wdteipen · Post by **wdteipen** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 5:26 am

I'm no expert, but to help with your question regarding linseed oil it is my understanding that it is used in part for oil curing briar so it sounds safe to me. Others may know more.

Sasquatch · Post by **Sasquatch** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 10:09 am

Linseed oil has a reputation for flammability due to it's tendency to heat up when curing - a bucketful of linseed oil soaked rags will spontaneously combust, once in awhile.

The boiled or "treated" version of this oil will harden up when it cures, and this is desireable for a lot of stain/finish all-in-one kind of things, the so-called Danish Oils, for example.

Untreated linseed oil doesn't ever harden up - it never "cures". It is food safe in theory (it's flax oil), but you want to check your supply - often it contains petroleum based thinners.

In woodworking, linseed oil is used pretty regularly as a pre stain conditioner (applied 50/50 with spirits). As noted, it doesn't penetrate the wood all that super well, but it does penetrate endgrain or strange grain of any type, and seal it up. The result is much more even stain penetration when you try to color something.

For pipes, I would be curious to use the above method on a plateax top, to prevent the stain from wicking into the wood and giving that 1/4" or so of heavily stained looking wood at the top of the pipe.

Anybody? Anybody? Bueller?

Cariztian · Post by **Cariztian** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 5:09 pm

Hi all!

I've been staining, and sanding, staining .. and sanding, and so on, for about 4 times now.. it actually colors the wood really slowly, and pretty easily comes off the wood after light sanding with a 400 grit paper..
But as said, the color darkens after each time..

I've also now tried to mix the Organic powdered pigments with Denaturated alcohol.. it didnt mix up well, as it isnt soluble.. (the powder)

So now its up to finding some kind of pigments sold here in Sweden, wich IS soluble with denaturated alcohol!

Anyone have any ideas of pigments and such??

Thx

ToddJohnson · Post by **ToddJohnson** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 5:14 pm

I've got a lot of packets of alcohol soluble powdered stains that I bought some years ago in Denmark and Sweden. Unfortunately, they're somewhere in a box or bin that I can't put my hands on at the moment. All I know to tell you is that they're available at certain smaller hardware stores. Surely Love can give point you in the right direction. I'm sure you can also order Fiebings leather dies as well.

Todd

Cariztian wrote:Hi all!

I've been staining, and sanding, staining .. and sanding, and so on, for about 4 times now.. it actually colors the wood really slowly, and pretty easily comes off the wood after light sanding with a 400 grit paper..
But as said, the color darkens after each time..

I've also now tried to mix the Organic powdered pigments with Denaturated alcohol.. it didnt mix up well, as it isnt soluble.. (the powder)

So now its up to finding some kind of pigments sold here in Sweden, wich IS soluble with denaturated alcohol!

Anyone have any ideas of pigments and such??

Thx

Cariztian · Post by **Cariztian** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 6:09 pm

Ok! thx alot Todd!

Love, can you maybe give any directions in this?

Any particular place in stockholm or any particular company that you know of, selling alcohol soluble stains??

Thx!

[EDIT: Ordered Narvsvärta! And of course one block of briar!

so need to suggest any color pigments, as i now got something wich colors ^^]

Frank · Post by **Frank** » Wed Jan 21, 2009 9:09 pm

geigerpipes wrote:Hey Cariztian
I'm in Sweden and pretty much know where to get most of the stuff you need for pipemaking.
Feel free to give me a call for advice. Our tel. number is on our contact page on our site: http://www.geigerpipes.com/

Christian, you really should contact Love Geiger. All the information you need, he can supply and explain it all in Swedish.