On buttons and things

[Sasquatch]

Gentlemen, forgive me if I ramble, I'm working on a two-four of good strong Canadian beer here tonight.

I wanted to share some thoughts and glean some ideas about stem shapes. I'm sitting here smoking a radice (there's a picture in the general pipes section) which has, for all intents and purposes, too large of a button. Except.... it's perfectly comfortable. It's wonderful. The stem is not especally thin, housing the twin-bore guts and all, but the pipe is just incredibly comfortable.

People often say Wiley makes a comfortable stem, and that's true, but it's also not an especially thin one.

So I am coming into the belief that thinness, in and of itself, is not necessarily desireable. There are pipes which benefit from a thin treatment and a small button, but there are pipes which don't. In fact, I made a pipe with a very small button and kept it for myself, a 1/2 bent brandy, and I can't keep the thing in my mouth! But the same stem would work fine on a small straight pot, for example.

Another thing I've noticed is that my most comfortable pipes have stems that stay fairly thin for an inch or so. If things get too fat too fast, it's impossible to clench a pipe in the pre-molars, which is my tendency.

I've actually gone so far as to ask customers how they intend to hold a pipe, so that I can make a stem in a combination of thickness, bend, and button that will favor their usage.

Anyway, that's my dumb not-so-sober thought for the night. I'm gonna try to make my stems comfortable and pipe-appropriate, but making them thin is not an especially important consideration for some of them. (Now I gotta figure out which that is....)

Discuss.


Or, if you prefer, write a short essay describing whether or not you feel that Ishmael in "Moby Dick" qualifies as a hero, an anti-hero, or neither.

[Tyler]

Thin stem does not equal small button.


Jody's button design is easy to recognize and not small:

[jeff]

tyler's absolutely right. A thin mouthpiece generally (or to me, at least) means how thick it feels between the teeth--i.e. right behind the button. A thin and/or short button is another thing. Most of my pipe stems fall in a narrow range of acceptable dimensions for all of their parts in the last inch. Larger pipes are beefed up just a bit with greater thickness and width.

[Sasquatch]

So let me put this another way: do you guys feel that an Oom Paul would get a different button shape than a straight billiard, or would you make them relatively similarly?

EDIT: Tyler, that JD pipe's button looks a hell of a lot like the Radice I just picked up.

[kbadkar]

Queequeg is the hero, Ahab is not, Moby is the anti-hero, Ishmael is a fly on the wall that gets off on spermaceti.

[m.c.]

I think thin stems (behind the button) are liked by most. But the height and thickness of the button itself is a matter of personal preference. Although pipe reviews often say this and that pipe's button is very thin and comfortable, I find thicker buttons suit me better. By "button thickness", I mean the measurement from tip of mouthpiece to the back edge of the button. I even made a "deep throat" bit for myself, with the button being 10mm thick. As for button height, most factory pipes are pretty good for me.

[LexKY_Pipe]

Insightful discussion gentlemen. thx.

[T3pipes]

another point to consider-- where do you place the button in your mouth? between your lips and teeth? do you clench it in your teeth? is the button past your teeth and you clench the area in front of it?

[Sasquatch]

Exactly. I put almost all my pipes in my premolars, and they are none too flat, so I think I need a bigger button to help stabilize things.

[wdteipen]

On a commissioned pipe you can take the liberty of making the button style and bit thickness to suit your buyers preferences if you wish. But, if your making pipes to sell to the general pipe smoking/collecting community then it would be best to keep the dimensions within the realm of the majorities expectations. That's already been determined and is why the majority of the more experienced makers stay within a certain range of accepted dimensions. You can go rogue if you want but as far as I can tell, the majority of folks who do so end up selling to a small niche. Kinda reminds me of the movie The Jerk. Being innovative isn't a bad thing but you should do a lot of research on why things are done a certain way before you decide that way is wrong.

[Sasquatch]

Fair enough. And I'm not by any means trying to be unorthodox or even build a better mousetrap... I'm just progressing through the range of stuff that probably everyone here does. Lately, I've been paying more attention to button work because I have two pipes that are I think well within "established parameters" and yet do not work very well in my teeth, and others that I think of as being pretty well outside of normal parameters which I like very much. But we all have different teeth and all hold pipes differently, so naturally a "perfect for everyone" button isn't going to exist.

I am just trying to avoid selling someone a pipe that they don't especially like because the maker blew some technical balance of pipe size/shape vs button size and shape. And I'm a little mystified at this Radice, which looks uncomfortable and is one of my favorites. A raisin in my pudding that I wasn't expecting.

[Nick]

Wuite to the contrary. Our preconceptions of Ahab as a vengful nearly psychotic character lead us to see him as either of lesser import or down right bad - I am refraining from saying evil. But if you approach the book from the point of view that this man has been wronged and is doing his best, in his own dysfunctional way, to make things right, he can be percieved as a couragous hero.

What makes Ahab remarkable is how instead of taking the bitter pill given him, as Capt Pollard of the Essex did, Ahab took to the seas to set things to rights. Instead of rolling over and saying such is life, Ahab took charge and made his own destiny, albeit a fatal one.

[Sasquatch]

The trouble with that viewpoint, casting Ahab is seeking justice (or even merely seeking vengeance), and that he has a corresponding nobility of cause, is that his choices wind up doing harm to all, and most notably to Starbuck, whose moral objections to this crusade should, in a just world, leave him unsmitten. The fact that Starbuck is not saved, while Ishmael, who with the others took Ahab's oath, points more to the absurdity of life than to any nobility or justice in Ahab's cause.

Ahab is a well developed character (I won't use the term villain or even antagonist) whose suffering is real, and his desire for vengeance all too understandable... all too human. This is what makes him fascinating, but it doesn't make him a hero.

[Charl]

For a stupid African down south of the equator: What exqactly would that perimeters be for thickness in front of button, thickness of button and height of button? Or is that a pro thing and I'm stepping on toes? (Forgive me if I am) I always try to get more or less 3-3.5mm in front of the button, and the button height itself more or less 2-3mm more. But the thickness of the button is still a bit of a mystery to me. I just try it in my mouth and see what feels good.

[KurtHuhn]

I just try it in my mouth and see what feels good.

Nothing wrong with that method.

I typically have the bite area in front of the button to be 4mm, and the button is pretty much whatever looks good. I don't typically measure the button. Stem width at the button is very important as well, and for that I rarely go above 20mm, and typically stay in the 18mm range.

[m.c.]

My woe is no matter how thin the bit is, I can't manage to swallow saliva when the bit is between the jaws. Anybody can pull that off?