pipemakersforum.com

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2015 4:19 am**

Forstners have their uses in pipe making, just not for mortises.

Posted: **Sat Apr 18, 2015 8:26 am**

Thanks guys

Posted: **Wed Apr 22, 2015 4:15 pm**

I think what you really want is a 4 flute counter bore bit with and interchangeable pilot. They can be ordered in various sizes and the hole in the center of the bit will hold a pilot centering guide. The pilot guide ensures a square faced off surface. With the correct sizes both ends can be perfectly squared. I use these for callmaking when I tenon parts that I want to glue together.

Source I use is Enco, but McMaster Carr has a better selection and theirs has a pilot guides down to 3/32. http://www.mcmaster.com/#counterbores/=wv7hvb

Posted: **Wed Apr 22, 2015 5:33 pm**

dogcatcher wrote:I think what you really want is a 4 flute counter bore bit with and interchangeable pilot. They can be ordered in various sizes and the hole in the center of the bit will hold a pilot centering guide. The pilot guide ensures a square faced off surface. With the correct sizes both ends can be perfectly squared. I use these for callmaking when I tenon parts that I want to glue together.

Source I use is Enco, but McMaster Carr has a better selection and theirs has a pilot guides down to 3/32. http://www.mcmaster.com/#counterbores/=wv7hvb

Judas Priest! $40-$80 for a fancy drill bit, this is where the cost out weighs the need. Who the hell needs a perfectly flush mortise anyway.

Posted: **Wed Apr 22, 2015 5:42 pm**

Pennstateind.com has a similar ( for pen trimming ) rod and trimmer. Much cheaper. See if this could help? Lines stuff up well. Pin gages are nice also, but there we go again. Rockler has a sale every year.

Posted: **Wed Apr 22, 2015 6:33 pm**

Why do you need a perfectly flush mortise bottom? If you have the tenon totally flush to the bottom of the mortise it can get pushed out as the mortise bottom swells from exposure to moisture over time.

Posted: **Wed Apr 22, 2015 6:42 pm**

Ratimus wrote:Why do you need a perfectly flush mortise bottom? If you have the tenon totally flush to the bottom of the mortise it can get pushed out as the mortise bottom swells from exposure to moisture over time.

I mentioned that earlier and got no response.
Although I wasn't going to have the tenon fit butt flush to the mortise anyway, just wanted a nice clean and flat mortise base because I'm just anal that way.
So see'en it's more trouble and cost then it's worth, I've changed my mind about being anal about it now. Like I said earlier, "Who the hell needs a perfectly flush mortise anyway!"

Posted: **Tue May 05, 2015 4:00 pm**

Take a look at spot welding bits. They will leave a flat ledge. A bit pricey but readily available.

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Posted: **Thu May 07, 2015 7:40 pm**

I don't have a spot weld drill bit... but I need one.

Posted: **Thu May 07, 2015 8:36 pm**

Being the cheap bastard I am, I'm very happy with the tools at hand.
Hell, I'm not even sure if I can make decent pipes yet so I reckon I'll do with what I have till I can prove to myself I'm worth
better and fancier tools. But, I do appreciate help

Posted: **Thu May 07, 2015 10:59 pm**

Just a thought... use an undersized end mill bit, then turn [down] the delrin tenon to fit the mortise after glue up.

Posted: **Sat May 09, 2015 1:15 am**

eBay has the spot welding drill bits in 5/16" for about $9.00-$10.00 apiece. Cheaper in volume of course.

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Posted: **Sat May 09, 2015 8:29 am**

socrates wrote:eBay has the spot welding drill bits in 5/16" for about $9.00-$10.00 apiece. Cheaper in volume of course.

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Do you mean a spot drill or actually a spot welding drill bit? I can't see how the welding bits are any good for pipe making.

EDIT: I see there is more than one kind, you were talking about a different type than I was thinking about.

Posted: **Sun May 10, 2015 1:08 am**

caskwith wrote:
socrates wrote:eBay has the spot welding drill bits in 5/16" for about $9.00-$10.00 apiece. Cheaper in volume of course.

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Do you mean a spot drill or actually a spot welding drill bit? I can't see how the welding bits are any good for pipe making.

EDIT: I see there is more than one kind, you were talking about a different type than I was thinking about.

Nope not a drill bit that welds but one that dills out spot welds. It has to do that as flat as possible. Saw quite by chance on a show called "Wheeler Dealers" on Velocity cable channel. The mechanic spoke about them and their properties. Thought perfect for cutting the "ledge" at the bottom of the tenon. Hope that answers your question.

Paul

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Posted: **Sun May 10, 2015 1:40 pm**

LatakiaLover wrote:
sandahlpipe wrote:I suppose if you wanted to get a perfectly flat end in the mortise, you could go with a chucking reamer.
Nyet. Chucking reamers have a small 45-degree facet on the outside corner of each flute. After using one you still don't have a square-ended, flat-bottom hole.

I agree with Chris on this AND George is also correct. I'm having trouble wrapping my head around the obsession for a perfectly wall-to-wall flat bottom in the mortise.
The main goal is a few thousandths gap between the tip of the tenon and the bottom of the mortise. The facet on the end of a chucking reamer is what does the cutting. If the tip of the tenon is perfectly flat it will hit the spot where the facet meets the wall of the mortise and potentially create a larger than desired gap. All one has to do is cut, file, sand or chew a corresponding bevel on the tip of the tenon to thus allow it reach the design depth.
The whole drill then ream concept applies to working with Delrin tenons. The rod stock as it comes out of the extruder will vary a few thou, plus or minus. Drill undersize and then choose the proper reamer to give you whatever fit you are looking for that goes with the piece of Delrin stock you have in your inventory. The rod stock can vary down its length so mike the piece you're working with then choose your reamer.
If you are a fan of integral tenons then pay no heed at all to any of this (other than the shape of the tip) and cut your tenon to match whatever mortise you've put in the shank.

Posted: **Thu May 14, 2015 4:49 pm**

Well, I went and got me a Spot Weld Cutter Bit because it was cheap of course, about $10 and it looks to
be what I've been look'en for. Thank you for all the suggestions and knowledge.

Posted: **Fri May 15, 2015 3:05 am**

RDPowell wrote:Well, I went and got me a Spot Weld Cutter Bit because it was cheap of course, about $10 and it looks to
be what I've been look'en for. Thank you for all the suggestions and knowledge.

Fantastic!

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Posted: **Mon May 18, 2015 9:45 am**

Like others also mentioned, I'm a bit baffled by the need for a truly flat mortise bottom. In my opinion it is not necessary. A normal bradpoint or even high speed bit does the trick just fine. For me it's overthinking things.

Posted: **Mon May 18, 2015 11:08 am**

Charl wrote:Like others also mentioned, I'm a bit baffled by the need for a truly flat mortise bottom. In my opinion it is not necessary. A normal bradpoint or even high speed bit does the trick just fine. For me it's overthinking things.

Yes, I know Exactly what your saying and I do have a tendency to be more precise in what I'm doing then needed but, that's just what I have to deal with being Obsessive Compulsive and perfectionist that never sees perfection in anything he does. (That's not a joke)
On the other hand when drilling a stem for a tenon I don't want any gap between the tenon and base of mortise in the stem to collect nasties, call me anal!

Just to add, the $10 spot weld bit will do this if not minimize it to my liking without the added work of reamers and such.
I'm not trying to argue with you Charl, I admit I over think a lot but, it's just my nature to try and get everything perfect. Have I? Hell No!

Once I figure out it can't be done (by me), I'll give up........maybe.

If I wasn't this way you guys wouldn't have anybody to laugh at.

Posted: **Mon May 18, 2015 11:32 am**

RDPowell wrote:
Charl wrote:Like others also mentioned, I'm a bit baffled by the need for a truly flat mortise bottom. In my opinion it is not necessary. A normal bradpoint or even high speed bit does the trick just fine. For me it's overthinking things.
Yes, I know Exactly what your saying and I do have a tendency to be more precise in what I'm doing then needed but, that's just what I have to deal with being Obsessive Compulsive and perfectionist that never sees perfection in anything he does. (That's not a joke)
On the other hand when drilling a stem for a tenon I don't want any gap between the tenon and base of mortise in the stem to collect nasties, call me anal!

Just to add, the $10 spot weld bit will do this if not minimize it to my liking without the added work of reamers and such.
I'm not trying to argue with you Charl, I admit I over think a lot but, it's just my nature to try and get everything perfect. Have I? Hell No!
Once I figure out it can't be done (by me), I'll give up........maybe.

Please understand that SOME gap is necessary. If you bottom out you can create a gap at the shank/stem juncture. Said gap can be created by the wood swelling slightly from the moisture in the smoke stream. This swelling can push the stem out ever so slightly to ruin the no-gap joint you sweated blood to create. About .005 gap would be ideal. Any gunk that gets in there is going to be insignificant and can be taken care of in the regular cleaning and maintenance of the pipe.

If I wasn't this way you guys wouldn't have anybody to laugh at.

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