New, new new

Wilbur · Post by **Wilbur** » Mon Dec 25, 2006 5:03 pm

Hi Guys.
I have been directed to this site from another online buddy. I have a pretty nice shop - all Jet, full lathes, mini lathes, scroll saws, jointers , drill press, sanding center, basically I'm spoiled rotten.

I have been reading some of your posts but I am having trouble picturing the process and understanding the language. Can you recommend a DVD or some materials that will show me the process and learn the names?

Also, I noticed that there is some difference between using the drill press as opposed to using the lathe. I currently use a nova chuck, but quite clearly there are specialized , bits, chucks etc.

Can you recommend all of the needed bits, chucks etc.?

Where and how to obtain the best briar? As well as rods for stems?

I know that's asking a lot but if it's not much trouble I would appreciate advice.

Post by **Tyler** » Mon Dec 25, 2006 7:07 pm

Here is some more info, including some online video:

http://www.tylerlanepipes.com

Tyler

ToddJohnson · Post by **ToddJohnson** » Mon Dec 25, 2006 7:27 pm

Wilbur wrote:Hi Guys.
I have been directed to this site from another online buddy. I have a pretty nice shop - all Jet, full lathes, mini lathes, scroll saws, jointers , drill press, sanding center, basically I'm spoiled rotten.

I have been reading some of your posts but I am having trouble picturing the process and understanding the language. Can you recommend a DVD or some materials that will show me the process and learn the names?

Also, I noticed that there is some difference between using the drill press as opposed to using the lathe. I currently use a nova chuck, but quite clearly there are specialized , bits, chucks etc.

Can you recommend all of the needed bits, chucks etc.?

Where and how to obtain the best briar? As well as rods for stems?

I know that's asking a lot but if it's not much trouble I would appreciate advice.

Hello Wilbur,

Unless this post is the Christmas equivelant of an April fool's joke, I would suggest reading the archived threads in the forum. There are no DVD's to be consulted, and I fear your well-equipped woodshop will be of limited service when it comes to pipemaking. This forum exists as a starting point for aspiring or hobbyist pipemakers, and contains all the information necessary for you to get started. All you have to do is take the time to read the pertinent threads. The rest you'll have to pick up in the process of actually making some pipes.

Good luck, and welcome.

Todd

bvartist · Post by **bvartist** » Tue Dec 26, 2006 12:46 am

Hello Wilbur,

Welcome!

Pimo's pipecrafting book has a lot of useful general information.

http://www.pimopipecraft.com/

Best thing to do is read through this forum and ask a lot of questions!

David

ckr · Post by **ckr** » Tue Dec 26, 2006 10:25 am

Welcome Wilbur,

As others have mentioned, read - the terms will become familiar. Being spoiled rotton and having loads of tools is a great advantage but you will find that it does not equate to a decent pipe. Highly skilled hands, creative minds, an pair of keen eyes and above all a passion for what they do is what enables some of these guys to produce beautiful pieces. After a while you will realize it is the knowledge that they freely share in this forum that is more valuable than any of the tools we all could buy.

So again welcome and join the party.

Briar:
www.jhlowe.com
www.amsmoke.com
(The process to get GREAT briar is too involved to go into, so stick around Todd helps out there also)

acrylic:
http://delviesplastics.com

Cumberland or ebonite
www.pipemakers.org

Delrin:
www.onlinemetals.com

Pipemaking supplies in general:
www.jhlowe.com
www.pipemakers.org

As you read the posts other sources are presented here also, this is just a quickie.

Post by **KurtHuhn** » Tue Dec 26, 2006 6:08 pm

I'll echo the thoughts of everyone here. Most pipe makers have a rather ill-equipped shop when it comes to traditional woodworking. For instance, my shop consists of:
- Jet Midi-Lathe
- Jet Belt Grinder
- Delta 9" bandsaw
- Delta 9" drill press
- two 1725 RPM motors configured with sanding disks
- two sandblasting cabinets and a bigass compressor

And I consider this a full loadout for pipemaking. Others will add a small or mid-size metal lathe. I'm about to add a second, and larger, Jet wood lathe so that I can get a little more stability in turning, as well as add large bowl and platter capability.

As far as videos, Tyler already pointed out his site. I have, somewhere, a video of me turning a pipe, but I can't seem to find the mini-DV tape that I recorded it on. Nowhere will you find an actual DVD of the pipe making process, unless you're into glass pipes - in which case I suggest you look at ebay.

Using a lathe versus a drill press is mostly the preference of the pipe maker. I used a drill press when I first got started. Once I was able to afford a lathe, the drill press sat pretty much unused. Now it only gets used for drilling stock for shank or stem rings - or pressing pen pieces together. However, I know of a few pipe makers that bore pipes with a drill press.

All that said, all the tools in the world won't make you an even halfway decent pipe maker. It's all in the use of the tools, the understanding of the art associated with pipes, and the craftsmanship you put into each piece. Most of that can be learned by anyone, as long as you posess the dedication to do so.

For the process and procedure, I suggest you spend a few days reading the posts here. I wish I had the time to capture all the materials in the (in development) wiki so that it's all organized in an easy-to-read format. Some day soon, hopefully....

Wilbur · Post by **Wilbur** » Wed Dec 27, 2006 12:09 am

Thanks everyone!
No this is no joke just horribly nieve'. I've done a lot of wood working so I am greateful for the advice and understand that it will be practice that will pay off in continueing to shape better and better pipes.

I do have both full and mini Jet lathes so I guess those would be my starting place. As an apology, I also began to read AFTER I posted and realized exactly what you all have so kindly said. Read the posts, read the posts, read the posts! I'll have a great time doing so.

As a beginner exactly what chuck do you suggest, and , should I start with a pipe making kit to begin with?

That's probably right in front of my face as I begin to read.

Thanks again guys,
I look forward to learn while I turn.

ToddJohnson · Post by **ToddJohnson** » Wed Dec 27, 2006 12:57 am

Wilbur,

A pipemaking kit is a good place to start, though if you already have some mechanical ability and mastery over a wide variety of tools, you'll not find starting with an undrilled block much more difficult. Turning perfect tenons will likely be the sticking point until you have the proper tooling though. As far as your chuck goes, any independently adjustable 2-jaw chuck that works will work. I've seen homemade chucks with 50+ years of use that work as effectively now as they ever did. And, you can also have them professionally made from aircraft aluminium (www.lambpipes.com) for between $600 and $900. Also search the forum for "tower jaws" and see what you turn up.

Good luck,

Todd

LexKY_Pipe · Post by **LexKY_Pipe** » Wed Dec 27, 2006 10:55 am

Welcome Wilbur. You found the closest thing to an artisan's guild in finding this forum. Take time to read the previous threads. You can't find the info posted here in any book.

Welcome to Pipedom!

chay · Post by **chay** » Wed Dec 27, 2006 1:53 pm

Welcome Wilbur,
Glad to know I'm not the only newbie in the group. All the links that everyone else posted are just about it, so I can't add much to the discussion other than to say I'm in the same boat. I bought a kit at, of all places, tinder box ( instant gratification). I have started to shape it some,but Christmas kinda got in the way,lol. Anyway, enjoy...once I get my "masterpiece" finished I'll try to post some pics (it may just be of me tossing it into the trash,hehe.)

Wilbur · Post by **Wilbur** » Wed Dec 27, 2006 5:41 pm

I don't know if I'd have detailed evidence like pics around, but I'm sure I throw my share in the trash. After Seeing Tylers site and watching the video there it was a HUGE help in understanding the basics!

I have most of what I need, but I do not have a metal lathe, I know I'll have fun looking around for one, but is there a specific Braand or model that most like?

I am also interested in the reshaping of the spade bits. Do you just start grinding away until you get the shape you want , or, are there desired shapes you are aiming for?

Last, I have both a grinder and a polishing wheel. One side of the polishing wheel I use polishing compounds like the ones I've seen mentioned, the other wheel I reserve for carnuba only. I may be mistaken but I thought I read that there is a need for another entire Unit? or just change the buffing wheels for what you need at the time?

Again thanks, I learned a crazy amount from the site and what I read last night. It kept me reading until about 3:30am. And I'm paying for it Now!

marks · Post by **marks** » Wed Dec 27, 2006 8:47 pm

Wilbur, you can make pipes with less than what has been mentioned here. I use the following:
drill press (drilling briar)
Taig lathe (drilling rod and delrin)
delta belt/disc combo (disc for squaring blocks prior to setting them up on the drill press-very important) (belt for cutting stems, and limited shaping)
dremel (shaping)
dust collector
buffing/disc sanding setup (shaping and buffing)
files (all kinds and sizes, including several tiny files for airway shaping near the button in the stem)
sandpaper

I do use tapered drill bits to drill the stem rods, I shape my own spade bits for drilling briar.

Good luck in your pipe making endeavors.

bscofield · Post by **bscofield** » Wed Dec 27, 2006 9:35 pm

Hey Wilbur... glad to see you made it here (I'm isaac over on CPS). Keep reading, have fun!

Wilbur · Post by **Wilbur** » Thu Dec 28, 2006 12:38 am

Marks,
Thanks so much! It's becoming very clear that a good portion of this is trial and error! Is the Taig a metal lathe? I haven't heard of that one.

I have a nice selection of files, sanders of various kinds, both electric and Hand. My sanders run from small hand held simple blocks to the Delta Sanding center with a 6 inch wide belt and a 15 inch disc on the side, orbital sanders, smaller hand held belt sanders etc.

So I guess that those could be used for a fair amount of the shaping. I would think that starting with maybe 120 grit and work down to 800 or 1200? Or would you start with a less aggressive grit?

What is the average cost of a metal lathe? and should it be in the midi, or, mini size?

Ben, Thanks for leading me to this site! I love it...although I'm sure everyone else is probably going to impose some sort of Gothic, inquisition style punishment on you designed to keep you alive while having to read my inane questions and way too long posts. I can hardly wait to get started. How can you tell if the briar is dried( cured?) long enough? Or, does it usually arrive pretty much ready to ruin?

Thanks again Ben and Marks,
and my sincere apologies to all the rest for the length.

magruder · Post by **magruder** » Thu Dec 28, 2006 1:48 am

Hi Wilbur,
Most serious pipemakers start shaping a block with 36 grit discs.
As for a lathe, a metal lathe is most often reccommended. Jet 9x12 metal lathes are
in common use. Be aware you'll spend as much on accessories for the lathe as the lathe itself. You can do w/out one as Kurt does, but if you're going to buy one anyway, I'd go for the metal variety. You can do everything from shaping and drilling to making stems and decorative rings.
Wood purchased from reputable sources should be ready to work.
Good luck and welcome.
Steve Morrisette

ckr · Post by **ckr** » Thu Dec 28, 2006 6:19 am

The Taig is a metal lathe.

www.cartertools.com

He has a pipemakers package - however I would skip all the risers and extras for wood working. The chuck's max is 1 and 1/8 inch and can't hold anything but the smallest of blocks. For the money it is a pretty good piece of equipment and excellent for stem work.

Post by **KurtHuhn** » Thu Dec 28, 2006 12:20 pm

I'll toss my can of gasoline on the fire here again and mention that a metal lathe is not strictly necessary for pipe making. I've never owned one, and have no plans to. HOWEVER, I construct all my tenons from delrin, so I don't do the single operation I might use a metal for. I do the grand majority of all my work on that Jet Midi lathe. I am, however, going down to Woodcraft today to drool over a larger Jet wood lathe. We shall see what I come with....

As far as shaping, I use a 120 grit belt on a MultiTool grinder (essentially a 1HP Jet grinder with a MultiTool on the right hand side). It's a 2x36 belt, and is great for roughing in most of the shapes I do. However, I also have some larger discs mounted on motors, and those are used for refining the shapes, and getting into spots that I can't reach with the belt. Those are usually 120 or 220 grit. All finish sanding is done on the lathe, only because that's what I'm comfortable using. That will change, most likely, as I move my workshop into my basement and get room to setup a bunch of new motors and sanding discs that I have in storage.

Personally? I would hold off on the purchase of a metal lathe just for pipe making until you're sure you want to do it. That is, unless, you have another purpose for that tool. The Jet BD920 is the favored metal lathe if purchasing new. It's got a great cost/performance ratio. Stay away from Enco and similar....

Briar, if bought from another pipe maker, typically will come ready to work. If bought from overseas, direct from the cutter, it will require some curing time. The exact time depends on the briar, and how well the cutter has treated it. Personally, I let my cutter-bought briar age at least 18 months before using it. I have some that has been aging for over 3 years, and still isn't (in my opinion) ready to use.

Bit shaping is easy. I use silver and deming bits that I profile with a hand-held angle grinder while the bit is chucked in the lathe and spinning at about 1200 RPM. It freaks my wife right out. Then I fine tune the cutting edges using my benchtop grinder and a grinding stone chucked in my Foredom handpiece. I like using these much more than reshaped spade bits - there's less chatter and they're more stable while boring.

I do recommend a little conservative reflection before running out and buying tooling specifically to make pipes. I've seen a few folks go into this head first, then burn out after a couple months. A friend of mine tends to go full-force and gung-ho into new hobbies about twice per year, and every time he finds a new hobby he sells off all the tools or toys from the previous one at a significant loss. I just hate seeing people make that mistake.

From the sound of it, you've already got a well-stocked woodworking shop. Chances are you could probably make pipes with no additional large investment, just some bits to bore the tobacco chambers.

If you don't mind my asking, what sort of stuff do you currently make with your tools? Furniture? Instruments? Inquiring minds want to know!

ToddJohnson · Post by **ToddJohnson** » Thu Dec 28, 2006 12:57 pm

KurtHuhn wrote:I do recommend a little conservative reflection before running out and buying tooling specifically to make pipes. I've seen a few folks go into this head first, then burn out after a couple months. A friend of mine tends to go full-force and gung-ho into new hobbies about twice per year, and every time he finds a new hobby he sells off all the tools or toys from the previous one at a significant loss. I just hate seeing people make that mistake.

Kurt,

Don't discourage the "diving in head first" approach. If you do, there will be less pipemakers who's shops to pilfer once they tire of their pursuits.

I've got a tool fetish to feed here! In all seriousness, these are wise words from Kurt. I seriously have purchased two well-equipped shops full of virtually new tools from guys who's deep pockets caused them to be foolish. Prudence wins the day.

Todd

Post by **Tyler** » Thu Dec 28, 2006 4:35 pm

KurtHuhn wrote: I do recommend a little conservative reflection before running out and buying tooling specifically to make pipes. I've seen a few folks go into this head first, then burn out after a couple months. A friend of mine tends to go full-force and gung-ho into new hobbies about twice per year, and every time he finds a new hobby he sells off all the tools or toys from the previous one at a significant loss. I just hate seeing people make that mistake.

Just to throw in a contrary opinion, why is this a mistake? Does your friend regret the process? For some, the pursuit of new hobbies IS a hobby, and the cyclical binging and purging is a pleasure in and of itself.

That said it is very possible to make pipes without a metal lathe, as Kurt attests. I made lots without one. However, it was the single most strategic tool acquisition that increased the quality of my pipes. As a beginner though, I'm not sure you'd notice. Acquiring a metal lathe at this point is a lot like buying a fine writing pen for a kindergartner. It will be a nice tool for him someday, but at this point there are lots of other lessons that can be learned without it. If you have the room and the coin, I'd say go for it. (I would.) But again, it is not completely necessary.

Tyler

Post by **KurtHuhn** » Thu Dec 28, 2006 7:48 pm

ToddJohnson wrote: Don't discourage the "diving in head first" approach. If you do, there will be less pipemakers who's shops to pilfer once they tire of their pursuits. I've got a tool fetish to feed here! In all seriousness, these are wise words from Kurt. I seriously have purchased two well-equipped shops full of virtually new tools from guys who's deep pockets caused them to be foolish. Prudence wins the day.

Hmmm. You have a point. I've picked up tools and great briar from a couple guys that over-bought and then lost interest.

Ignore what I said. Buy buy buy!

Tyler wrote: Just to throw in a contrary opinion, why is this a mistake? Does your friend regret the process? For some, the pursuit of new hobbies IS a hobby, and the cyclical binging and purging is a pleasure in and of itself.

I tend to be a fiscal conservative, and I usually scrutinize every tool purchase to be sure it's exactly what I need. Now, that said, I won't tell anyone *not* to get a particular (unless I know the particular tool is junk), but I do like to caution folks about how much they choose to spend before they really even know wether they're going to persue the hobby.

My buddy doesn't regret the process, to him it's just the way he lives. To me it seems like an endless stream of "almosts" and "what could have beens". However, it does work out for me, since I can get all his tools and toys for next to nothing when he loses interest. I keep hoping he's going to take a hankering for wood turning and buy a Nova DVR3000.

pipemakersforum.com

New, new new

New, new new

Re: New, new new

sanding/shaping