The big vulcanite buy from Germany

[pierredekat]

There's one plastic I'm really intrigued by. It's called ABSYLUX®, and it's readily available in black rod form. Here's a pdf file from one company that's selling it.

3/4" rod stock is $3.97 per foot
7/8" rod stock is $4.99 per foot
1" rod stock is $6.58 per foot

But listen to the specs:

"Characteristics of ABS

Machining: ABS is easily machined and may be turned, bored, drilled, milled, sawed, diecut, sheared, and routed with ease using highspeed and carbide-tipped tools. ABS can also be easily machine-finished by filing, grinding, sanding, buffing and polishing.

Thermoforming: ABS is easily thermoformed and lends itself to remarkable reproduction of mold detail. Extruded ABS sheet can be easily heat formed to produce parts that are tough, durable and rigid, using any conventional thermoplastic sheet forming equipment.

Chemical Resistance: ABS has good chemical and stress-cracking resistance to inorganic salt solutions, alkalies, mineral acids (except strong oxidizing acids), and some mineral, vegetable, and animal oils. Chemical resistance does vary with the different grades of ABS. Petroleum based cutting and tapping oils should not be used in conjuction with ABS as they will cause the material to craze. Certain lubricants, gaskets, polishes and paints should be tested for compatibility before use.

Absylux® ABS is a low cost engineering plastic that is easy to machine and fabricate. An ideal material for structural applications when impact resistance, strength, and stiffness are required. It is widely used for machining pre-production prototypes since it has excellent dimensional stability and is easy to paint and glue. Natural (beige) and black Absylux are FDA compliant for use in food processing appllications."

So it's readily available in black rod form at a very nice price, and on paper, anyway, sounds like it will do the trick.

I think sometime next week I am going to order a piece and give it a go.

[KurtHuhn]

There's one plastic I'm really intrigued by. It's called ABSYLUX®, and it's readily available in black rod form. Here's a pdf file from one company that's selling it.

Hmm. McMaster-Carr sells the generic version of that. Maybe I'll get a rod the next time I order something from them.

[Danskpibemager]

Perhaps somebody can answer this question regarding stem materials. Aside from tradition and the way that it's always been done, why don't any "High Grade" pipemakers use alternative materials for stems to replace ebonite? Polycarbonate has the same "Teeth Feel" as ebonite and is a pleasure to work with. ABSYLUX is another material that seems to have greater advantages than ebonite so I may jump on the bandwagon and give it a try. What is the big hurdle with exceptance of alternative stem materials and does anyone ever believe that modern day plastics can replace ebonite and cumberland as their stem material of choice. Any input would really be appreciated! Thanks!!!

[JHowell]

ABS plastic has been around for awhile. I forget what the acronym is for, A-something Butyl Styrene? I certainly wouldn't discourage anyone from trying anything.

[KurtHuhn]

Cast polyester is also a great material, with wonderful tooth feel, and excellent workability. It is not without it's own problems, however. When bent with heat, it will eventually (over the course of a few years) revert to its cast shape. For that reason, I only use it on pipes with straight stems. It can be extremely attractive, especially the amber and faux horn.

[JHowell]

I don't think I've ever seen either of those two materials. Who has it?

[KurtHuhn]

Masecraft supply:
http://www.masecraftsupply.com/

Also a good source for interesting materials you can't use on pipes, like casein ivory, if you're making pens. Lots of antler and bone as well.

This pipe:
http://www.pipecrafter.com/pipes/noblem ... er_ale.php
uses the faux amber - which has that creamy, striated variegation of the cast amber (actually cast copal) stems from the mid part of this century. It doesn't look like much on the Masecraft website, but shaped into a stem, it's killer.

[Frank]

Aside from tradition and the way that it's always been done, why don't any "High Grade" pipemakers use alternative materials for stems to replace ebonite? Polycarbonate has the same "Teeth Feel" as ebonite and is a pleasure to work with. ABSYLUX is another material that seems to have greater advantages than ebonite so I may jump on the bandwagon and give it a try. What is the big hurdle with exceptance of alternative stem materials and does anyone ever believe that modern day plastics can replace ebonite and cumberland as their stem material of choice.

I think a major reason is "tradition". Most pipe smokers tend to be resistant to change in their pipe habits. A prime example is myself. When I first came across the P-lip I thought to myself "WTF is this? Maybe I'll just file it down to a regular button shape". Fortunately I decided to give it a try first. Now all my daily pipes have P-lip buttons, including a few I myself converted!

As for "tooth feel", I've yet to find a material that feels comfortable to me, aside from vulcanite.

[LatakiaLover]

My earlier comment in this thread concerning Bill Taylor's "Ashtonite," and how claims of its use---never mind its superiority---were inconsistent with the material used in mass-produced molded stems, brought several emails to my shop account asking to see the proof. Here you go.

(To those who wrote: I understand that Bill is something of a living legend in the pipe world, and has accomplished much. To my mind, the people who have earned such reputations should constantly be trying to live up to them, however, not use them as some sort of shield. I certainly bear him no ill will. Repairmen are just the Sergeant Fridays of the industry. We see everyone's output, and tend to call 'em the way we see 'em. "Just the facts, ma'm." Those carvers who do impressively good work get recognized for it just as quickly.)

[JHowell]

Masecraft supply:
http://www.masecraftsupply.com/

Also a good source for interesting materials you can't use on pipes, like casein ivory, if you're making pens. Lots of antler and bone as well.

Thanks for the link. Why couldn't you use casein ivory on pipes? Especially if it would make a good pen -- you wouldn't have to use it for a mouthpiece.

[JHowell]

My earlier comment in this thread concerning Bill Taylor's "Ashtonite," and how claims of its use---never mind its superiority---were inconsistent with the material used in mass-produced molded stems, brought several emails to my shop account asking to see the proof. Here you go.

I dunno -- I don't know much, if anything, about Ashton pipes and what Ashtonite is supposed to be, but I think a Churchwarden is kind of a special case. Other than nuts (and I use the term affectionately) like Kurt and Trever, are there any makers who produce Churchwardens in any quantity using rod stock? Those stems are a huge PITA. Regarding pipes of normal dimensions, is there such a thing as black Ashtonite? I guess what got me thinking was the suggestion of industrial espionage. A spy or break-in I would consider conduct unbecoming a gentleman, but various companies test each others' products routinely. If vulcanite can be made that oxidizes less, or not at all, I wonder why the makers of vulcanite wouldn't produce it as a matter of course.

[LatakiaLover]

Other than nuts (and I use the term affectionately) like Kurt and Trever, are there any makers who produce Churchwardens in any quantity using rod stock?

Sure. Dunhill does. Upshall too. The pipes mades for Astley's came from several sources, but were always from rod regardless of shape. If you count the older stuff, all the Barling and Comoy cw's did. Among U.S. carvers, there's Paul Bonaquisti, who makes (well, made before his move and new store, anyway) so many cw's they are his signature shape.

My point wasn't whether they are tough to make, though, but showing that there's more looseness with the facts regarding "Ashtonite" than even if it actually exists. I wouldn't mind at all that Bill used molded stems that weren't made of his proprietary substance, btw, if he'd simply say so, and price those pipes accordingly. But his PR package says nothing about using it sometimes, and not others:

Two further Taylor innovations are also particularly worthy of note: Ashtonite, the stem material used on Ashton pipes and the patented Pebble Shell method. ...

The first example of this, as stated above, was his adoption of Ashtonite as a stem material. Essentially, Ashtonite is a blend of Vulcanite and Plexiglas. Vulcanite had been the standard stem material for English briar pipe for almost a century before Taylor developed Ashtonite. Vulcanite had clear advantages; it was soft on the teeth, easily worked with as a stem material and inexpensive by comparison to other materials used for stems at the beginning of the 20th century (the alternatives a century ago included materials like amber, which was exceedingly expensive). The disadvantages of Vulcanite are primarily that it is soft, and, therefore, easily damaged by clenching too hard on the pipe. Also, since Vulcanite is, quite simply, vulcanized rubber, it oxidizes when exposed to oxygen. This gives it an ugly appearance and a very unpleasant taste. Plexiglas, frequently used in Italy, solves many of the problems of Vulcanite. However, in eliminating the problems of durability and oxidation, one also loses the primary advantage of Vulcanite: Plexiglas is hard on the teeth. Ashtonite helps to find a common groundit has much of the durability of Plexiglas (it doesnt turn, nor is it easily damaged through wear) and yet is sufficiently softer than Plexiglas to make the stem more comfortable in the mouth. Though there is no real solution to the problem and the decision of what material to use in stem making really is a balance of various advantages and disadvantages, Ashtonite helps to fulfill a much needed middle ground.

That cw in the pics was made in 2006, which was well after the whole Ashtonite thing was declared, in case you can't make out the date (it's a bit glare-y).

[LatakiaLover]

Regarding the above, it isn't my intention to "out" Bill Taylor in some way. The subject came about as the thread evolved a page or so back, when several people said they were unable to detect "Ashtonite," and wondered if anyone else could. I replied (in essence) there were other questions besides that regarding Ashton's stems, which suggests that veracity in general might be an issue. To not go on what might be a snipe hunt for "Ashtonite," in other words, if securing a supply was the point of asking about it.

Then some emails suggested if I were going to make such a statement I'd better show some proof, because (again, in essence) I'm an unknown repairman while Bill has been a highly regarded and respected maker for decades, and they couldn't imagine he operated that way.

The issue grew a bit, in other words.

[KurtHuhn]

Thanks for the link. Why couldn't you use casein ivory on pipes? Especially if it would make a good pen -- you wouldn't have to use it for a mouthpiece.

Good point. I was thinking strictly as a mouthpiece, but you could use it for accent rings. The only problem I see is that the beauty of the material wouldn't be apparent on a small piece like a stem ring - though it could be striking as a shank end cap.

The reason why you can't use it for a mouthpiece is that casein ivory is very sensitive to moisture, and will swell and change dimensions. I don't have a lot of direct exposure to it, but from what I understand, using it as a mouthpiece could result in a mess.

[Nick]

Cool! I may try the ABS too.

[JHowell]

My point wasn't whether they are tough to make, though, but showing that there's more looseness with the facts regarding "Ashtonite" than even if it actually exists. I wouldn't mind at all that Bill used molded stems that weren't made of his proprietary substance, btw, if he'd simply say so, and price those pipes accordingly. But his PR package says nothing about using it sometimes, and not others:

Two further Taylor innovations are also particularly worthy of note: Ashtonite, the stem material used on Ashton pipes and the patented Pebble Shell method. ...

The first example of this, as stated above, was his adoption of Ashtonite as a stem material. Essentially, Ashtonite is a blend of Vulcanite and Plexiglas. Vulcanite had been the standard stem material for English briar pipe for almost a century before Taylor developed Ashtonite. Vulcanite had clear advantages; it was soft on the teeth, easily worked with as a stem material and inexpensive by comparison to other materials used for stems at the beginning of the 20th century (the alternatives a century ago included materials like amber, which was exceedingly expensive). The disadvantages of Vulcanite are primarily that it is soft, and, therefore, easily damaged by clenching too hard on the pipe. Also, since Vulcanite is, quite simply, vulcanized rubber, it oxidizes when exposed to oxygen. This gives it an ugly appearance and a very unpleasant taste. Plexiglas, frequently used in Italy, solves many of the problems of Vulcanite. However, in eliminating the problems of durability and oxidation, one also loses the primary advantage of Vulcanite: Plexiglas is hard on the teeth. Ashtonite helps to find a common groundit has much of the durability of Plexiglas (it doesnt turn, nor is it easily damaged through wear) and yet is sufficiently softer than Plexiglas to make the stem more comfortable in the mouth. Though there is no real solution to the problem and the decision of what material to use in stem making really is a balance of various advantages and disadvantages, Ashtonite helps to fulfill a much needed middle ground.

That cw in the pics was made in 2006, which was well after the whole Ashtonite thing was declared, in case you can't make out the date (it's a bit glare-y).

That's from his PR packet? I'm no chemist, but wonder how it would be possible to mix hard rubber, which must be vulcanized with heat and sulfur to be rigid, with acrylic (a catalyzed resin). A special UV inhibitor package in the rubber chemistry, that I could believe. Oh, well. No real point in it. I would expect that rubber companies already have developed their products as well as their chemists and market forces allow.

[RadDavis]

Hi Jack,

If "they" can mix briar and nylon to make Brylon, then mixing rubber and plastic should be no problem at all.

Rad

[LatakiaLover]

Jack --

Exactly. The entire "mix" thing has the feel of an advertising angle of some sort that the initiator didn't expect to be examined closely. Or, more likely, didn't realize it could be.

My 100% unverified, complete gut-feel suspicion is that Bill came up with some post-factory manufacturing process---"cooking" vulcanite rods in heated oil for a while, for example---and decided to re-name the result. The confusion since on the part of people like us, and as seen in advertising literature, is just dodging and weaving. Trying to keep the actual process secret.

Such an explanation fits all the facts quite neatly. It also---and I truly like this part best---allows room for Bill to be cast simply as a wily old codger with a sense of humor. Deception in pursuit of keeping secrets isn't lying, per se, it's just part of the game.

Go ask any winner of a big chili or BBQ cook off what their recipe is. They'll tell you, every time. Then make the recipe and report back. LOL! Is that lying? No, that's just how it's done. (i.e. you're dumb enough to ask, you deserve to be taken for a ride)