CNC-machines?

Bizzozero · Post by **Bizzozero** » Thu Sep 18, 2008 1:20 pm

Dose anybody know if it is at all possible to use a CNC-machine (4-axis cnc mill to be precise) for the whole drilling and shaping process? Right of hand I can't think of any reasons why it should be impossible, but so far my experience in pipe making consists of making some half descent freehand carving out of some very indecent pre-drilled bits of briar so I thought I'd better fish around a bit for thoughts and experience here before starting to experiment with it.

Post by **KurtHuhn** » Thu Sep 18, 2008 5:47 pm

I see no reason why it wouldn't work. I've seen some pretty complex things done with CNC machines.

kbadkar · Post by **kbadkar** » Thu Sep 18, 2008 6:20 pm

I think the programming, set-up time, and cost of running a machining center makes it cost ineffective, unless you crank out 500 pipes. In my business (industrial valves), at least, it isn't cost effective to use the CNCs unless it's a high volume production run.

But I imagine you know what it takes to get a CNC machine ready to roll. It just seems odd to make a one off. Part of the joy of a handmade pipe is knowing it's unique. I don't know where the line is drawn between a handmade pipe and a machine made pipe and that line would certainly be blurred if you created an original design on a CNC to make one pipe.

JHowell · Post by **JHowell** » Fri Sep 19, 2008 9:10 am

I see little difference between the use of a CNC mill and the use of pattern-copying fraising machines. CNC may be capable of a little more intricacy, and may be able to produce a better surface finish, but that takes time. If you drill the bowl first and then clamp on a mandrel it should be possible for a CNC to do drill the mortise and airway, which would be new.

The CNC pipe, though, will suffer from the same problem as all machine-made pipes in that it will not interact with the grain. Perhaps the savings in time will make up for the waste in briar.

As far as one-offs are concerned, I think CNC shines at them, unless you have to keep the machine running lights out to pay for it or to keep up with orders. If you don't like what you made, you can change the code and make another one, ad infinitum, without committing to a production run or changing half a dozen setups. Whether it's really practical in the end will depend on who owns the machine and what it's for. If I owned a 4-axis Mori Seki and used it to make titanium high vacuum chambers, I wouldn't want somebody filling it full of briar dust. A real pipe-making CNC setup would be a dedicated woodworking machine, and presumably those are already made. I don't know what the spindle speed is like on a typical CNC mill, but 10,000 rpm is at the low end for a router bit, and at the upper end for a metal-cutting tool.

Bizzozero · Post by **Bizzozero** » Fri Sep 19, 2008 1:29 pm

kbadkar wrote:I think the programming, set-up time, and cost of running a machining center makes it cost ineffective.

If I'd wanted to be cheap and effective I'd be a cigarette smoker... but actually the particular machine and software I was thinking of using is part of the machine-park in the workshop at my school. It's for prototyping, so it's great fore making a one off but it would be hopeless for for mass production as there is no way of optimizing the operations. When I think about I probably should have been a bit clearer about that. I agree it would seem odd to go through the whole business of operation optimization and calibrating for a one of. Especially for something made of wood

Bizzozero · Post by **Bizzozero** » Fri Sep 19, 2008 2:05 pm

JHowell wrote:The CNC pipe, though, will suffer from the same problem as all machine-made pipes in that it will not interact with the grain. Perhaps the savings in time will make up for the waste in briar.

I just make pipes for the joy of it (for now at least) so cost and effectiveness isn't really an issue (especially since I don't foot the bills for the machine). Getting the grain right is, though, and since I don't have any real experience I don't know how hard it is (I'd hazard a guess that it is pretty tricky, though). Do you think using the CNC-machine to drill the bowl, mortar and airway and giving the whole piece of wood roughly the intended shape, and then start working manually so to speak until I find the right grain could work?

Forgive me if I seem very ignorant, but actually I don't even know if the normal method is to drill out the bowl and airway in a bit of briar and then shape a pipe around it, or if the correct way is to shape a pipe from a bit of briar and then add bowl and airway at the end.

Frank · Post by **Frank** » Fri Sep 19, 2008 2:38 pm

Bizzozero wrote:Do you think using the CNC-machine to drill the bowl, mortar and airway and giving the whole piece of wood roughly the intended shape, and then start working manually so to speak until I find the right grain could work?.

Absolutely. It's no different than partly turning the stummel on a lathe, then hand finishing it.

Bizzozero wrote:Forgive me if I seem very ignorant, but actually I don't even know if the normal method is to drill out the bowl and airway in a bit of briar and then shape a pipe around it, or if the correct way is to shape a pipe from a bit of briar and then add bowl and airway at the end.

Both methods are "correct". It depends on the design and the preference of the pipemaker.