Water in the Stem

[m.c.]

Hi, everyone. Glad to post my first topic. I have been wondering how you address the issue of water in the stem while smoking. I can't figure out whether it is condensation or saliva. Anyway, it is a plague to me. As ebonite and acrylic do not absorb any liquid, I have managed a perfectly dry smoke by fitting a non-hard wood stem. The trade-off, however, is that I can never make it as thin as ebonite or acrylic stems due to lack of strength. Nor is it fit for the teeth (or eye). The question is, is there any solution to get the best of both worlds?

Briar does a poor job of sucking up all the liquid, so I don't expect much from a water chamer (or anything you call it) in the shank.

[ToddJohnson]

Hi, everyone. Glad to post my first topic. I have been wondering how you address the issue of water in the stem while smoking. I can't figure out whether it is condensation or saliva. Anyway, it is a plague to me. As ebonite and acrylic do not absorb any liquid, I have managed a perfectly dry smoke by fitting a non-hard wood stem. The trade-off, however, is that I can never make it as thin as ebonite or acrylic stems due to lack of strength. Nor is it fit for the teeth (or eye). The question is, is there any solution to get the best of both worlds?

Briar does a poor job of sucking up all the liquid, so I don't expect much from a water chamer (or anything you call it) in the shank.

Unless I misunderstand your question, I don't think we're talking about the same sort of "pipe" here. Try us back in ten years, when tobacco has been banned and marijuana is fully legal.

Todd

[Ryan]

HAHAHAHAHAHA

[KurtHuhn]

My bet is that it's condensation from the tobacco. A lot of tobaccos, primarily aromatic tobaccos, have a very high moisture content. All that moisture usually ends up in the very bottom of the tobacco chamber and in the airway unless you account for it.

The easiest way to counter this is to use a wide airway. Most folks use an airway on the order of 4mm in diameter, and some even go a little wider.

Also, make sure the transition from the airway to the slot at the button is gradual by using a tapered bit.

And, while shaping the funnel in the end of the stem near the button, make sure it's a gradual shape with no hard edges internally.

The goal is to get the air to pass through the shank and stem with as little resistance as possible. Less resistance equals less turbulence, and less turbulence will equal less moisture coming out of the smoke.

AND, further still , make sure the hole on the stem's tenon lines up as close to perfectly as you can get it with the hole at the bottom of the mortis. And make sure the tenon is as close to being exactly as long long as the mortis is deep as you're able to get it. It doesn't have to be dead-nuts perfect, but it should be as close as your skills and equipment will allow.

[Frank]

If I understand you correctly, you have a "wet smoker" problem.

Replacing an acrylic/vulcanite stem with an absorbent soft wood stem will work for a short while, but eventually it will reach saturation with tobacco oils/tars and taste like crap. Brigham pipes use a similar idea with their disposable maple wood filters.

Excessive moisture in the stem/shank is a combination of tobacco moisture condensing and saliva wicking off the tongue into the stem. I am also a very wet smoker and have tried various different pipe designs that try to combat this problem. The design that I found to be most effective for me is the "Peterson System", i.e. a P-Lip stem and a moisture sump at the bottom of the shank (my daily smokers are all well bent). There are a number of pipe makes that employ this same "System". I converted all of my Oom Paul pipes to P-Lip stems (by virtue of the design, they already have a moisture sump), and they are my favourite smokers.

Initially, I used a filter as well, but found it too restrictive to the smoke flow - a filter seems to make very little difference to the dryness/wetness of the smoke with this type of System.

[Sasquatch]

Brigham's filter system is a 3" long tube of maple, which absorbs a significant amount of moisture without taking away much flavor. Makes for a pretty good smoke, actually.

Really though, this comes down to smoking technique (unless you have a REAL junker of a pipe). Dry your tobacco a bit - most are sold at a moisture content far too high for ideal smoking. With tobacco that is not quite crispy but fairly dry, put a few pinches in the pipe and tamp them in gently - I tend to fill a pipe loose then pack it down by half.

Smoking hot is the chief cause of serious moisture - water is a product of combustion, and if you smoke real fast, the pipe won't be able to dissipate the moisture. Starting with wet tobacco only adds to this, of course.

[pierredekat]

A few other things worth considering:

1) Take a little of your favorite tobacco out and let it air-dry for awhile before you smoke it. Maybe 15-30 minutes will do the trick in a moderate temperature/humidity environment.

2) Only put as much tobacco into the bowl as you have time to smoke, and then completely smoke it. Basically the goal here is to leave as little dottle/moisture in the bottom of the bowl as possible. Of course, you don't want to get too carried away with this, or you risk charring the bottom of the bowl.

3) After every smoke, blow as much moisture out of the stem as possible, and then wipe out the bowl with a twist of paper towel. That way, you're not starting off with excess moisture in the pipe on the next go-round. Of course, running a pipe cleaner through from time to time is a good idea, as well.

[JimBridger]

Have you tried smoking a ceramic pipe? These will absorb moisture like a sponge and if they ever become loaded up with tars and such a quick bake in the oven burns away all the residue while leaving the pipe unharmed.

[m.c.]

Thank you so much for your kind suggestions.

Frank suggested the moisture "sump" pipes. Yeah, that's the word I fumbled for and in its absence used "water chamber", which perhaps explains why Todd mistook me for a hemp junkie.

I got all the moisture even when smoking English blends and even when I smoke really slow and cool. Then the culprit must be the cheap pipe I use

Fortunately, my wood stem hasn't been used for long and does not smell so crappy now. When it does, I will try scrubbing it up with alcohol.

The ceramic pipe said by Jim really surprised me. I always thought ceramic was the least absorbent stuff. I wish I could find such a pipe and try... Besides, isn't it hard to keep the tobacco lit in a ceramic bowl?

Kurt's comments are most revealing, with detailed technical solutions. Being a ham-fisted DIY fan, I can't yet imagine how far precise working of the airway/tenon/mortise will solve the problem of moisture. A dry smoke without using any filter is a craved mystery to me (maybe untill I can get my skill and tools drastically improved or can afford a Dunhill). Anyway, I will try Curt's suggestions, although success will probably take some time due to the learning curve

[Frank]

Kurt's comments are most revealing, with detailed technical solutions. Being a ham-fisted DIY fan, I can't yet imagine how far precise working of the airway/tenon/mortise will solve the problem of moisture. A dry smoke without using any filter is a craved mystery to me (maybe untill I can get my skill and tools drastically improved or can afford a Dunhill). Anyway, I will try Kurt's suggestions, although success will probably take some time due to the learning curve

It's not that difficult. Take a 9/64" (or 5/32") drill bit, clamp the shank end of the bit in a vise and ream out the draught hole by carefully hand rotating the shank end of the stummel onto the bit until the tip of the bit appears in the tobacco chamber.

You will need a long length taper bit the same diameter to ream the stem, provided the pipe has a straight stem. If the stem is curved, it will first need to be straightened by heating and "unbending" it. You need to use extreme care when reaming the stem, as it is very easy to crack the tenon. The stem can be reamed using power tools, but I don't want to complicate the procedure at this stage.

It would be less hassle to try a Peterson System pipe. These WDC Wellingtons are exact copies of the Peterson. Spend a few bucks on an estate pipe, refurb it and give it a try. Get the standard (approx. 6 1/4") length one. I have 1/2 dozen of these in my daily rotation: eBay Wellingtons

[m.c.]

Thanks for suggestions, Frank. I have tried opening up the airway of an estate pipe. Drilling the shank-end draft is not much trouble, but the thin mouthpiece puts a limit there. Despite the opening up of airway to 4.5mm, that pipe still turned out to be the wettest and hottest SOB I have ever suffered. I can only attribute this to the poorly designed mouthpiece and bowl/draft misalignment, or more willingly, to mystery.

Therefore I prefer making pipes from scratch to refurbishing an estate one. I can do bowl/draft alignment reasonably well with a handdrill clamped on a vise, but without a drill press the mortise/tenon fit is a real headache.

Comes to moisture, I know Peterson's patented Z-design, but unfortunately the very idea of a convoluated airway and a filth collecting sewer leaves me cold. Just because the muddy liquid does not play mischief does not mean its very existence in there is no longer stirring the bee in my bonnet No, I wasn't such an obssessive hopping-mad freak, until I made my own all-wood super-dry pipe mentioned above. If you could ever try it, I expect you to blissfully smash all your Petersons with a tomahawk

I guess next time I will try a non-hard wood (not properly SOFT wood) extention to the shank, to be completed with a tiny acrylic mouthpiece at the end. This is the only way I can think of to harness the driness and at the same time make it teeth-worthy, although my tenon-mortise headache is bound to be doubled...

[KurtHuhn]

You pretty much hit on one reason why I LOVE pipes with bamboo shanks and stems. Even though I don't have a problem with moist tobacco, the bamboo absorbs so much of the excess that it takes any smoke to the next level of pleasure.

[Frank]

You pretty much hit on one reason why I LOVE pipes with bamboo shanks and stems. Even though I don't have a problem with moist tobacco, the bamboo absorbs so much of the excess that it takes any smoke to the next level of pleasure.

Ahh, now there's an idea. Perhaps a longish bamboo shank similar to this: http://pipedia.org/index.php?title=Imag ... pipe_6.jpg

[KurtHuhn]

The owner of the pipe below has excellent things to say about its smoking properties.

[Frank]

The owner of the pipe below has excellent things to say about its smoking properties.

... and he's so modest it hurts!

[KurtHuhn]

And my shank is longer too.

[Frank]

And my shank is longer too.

OMG! Now he's starting a shank wagging contest. (Umm, I'm dyslexic, should that actually read "wank shagging"?).

[m.c.]

Comes to shank-wagging, I have discovered something interesting today. Moisture apart, these days I'm more obssessed with how to achive a cool smoke, as the scorching summer days are aggravating my tongue bite (or at least my perception of it). Today I made an experimentaion of extending the stem of an old pipe to see how far it cools the smoke. It was done on a poor-quality non-briar billiard which has been collecting dust on the shelf for a long time. I cut a piece of bamboo the length of my forearm, drilled it through, filed the two ends so as to fit the mortise and tenon respectively, and connected the three parts (stummel, stem and bamboo), with the bamboo extention in between. All the working was pretty coarse so I spare you the picture. Anyway, I made sure the airway was smooth and connections were airtight. When I smoked it, this old pipe out-performed its former self in two aspects:

1. This alternative wood pipe used to do a poor job of keeping bobacco lit. The resultant quick draw invariably meant a hot smoke. But today after extending the stem, it burnt very steadily to the bottom bits of ashes (with a couple of relights), without the need for a mad draw.

2. As you expect, it smokes much cooler than before.

It must be noted that the long stem is no fool-proof cure for bite. I tried a quicker draw during the smoke. It may still bite if care is not taken. So what I'm most impressed with from this experimentation is the effect on stable tobacco burning rather than the long stem's own cooling effect. In a nutshell, the extention allows me to smoke slower while keeping tobacco lit.This is not what I expected before this experimentation and I don't understand why this happened. Do you have similar experience, or can you explain the aerodynamics behind it?

[m.c.]

Coming back to the moisture problem, today I tried Kurt's suggestion to see how to address it by smoothing the airway. I picked my wettest smoker, looked into the mortise, and discovered that there was a wide gap between the mortise bottom and the tenon end, and the tenon was unchamfered. That might be the cause of all the condensation, I thought, so I used a taper file to chamfer the inner wall of the tenon. Eager to prove the effect of this exercise, I kind of carried this to the extreme: as you see from the pic, I made a near zero-thickness tenon edge, and made the chamfer slope as flat as possible. The result was absolutely satisfactory. Previously during every smoke I had to unplug the stem several times to whip off the foul liquid. Today, when work was done, I smoked it to the bottom and whipped the stem toward a sheet of paper to see if there was any consensation - not a single drop!

Frankly, when I initially read about how "engineering" determined smoking pleasure, inclusing Kurt's kind advice, I took it with a pinch of salt, believing moisture was unavoidable with all plastic stems. But now I see the value of advice from a professional. Thanks to Kurt and all helpful guys on this forum. And, no more soft wood stems on my DIYs in future.