A Compliment and a Question

[NathanA]

First of all, I want to say how grateful I am for this forum and the fact that some really amazing pipe makers are so willing to help the rookies. Thank you everyone for the responses to my queries. My first two attempts were made on a whim and before I found this forum. Predictably, they did not go well so one is my shop pipe (I like it, but it is riddled with mistakes) and the other is on the scrap heap. I have not posted any pics because the mistakes were just too obvious and I was a little embarrassed. After much study and research I am working on my third. It is going well and I will post soon to get advice before I finish it. My question this time is about staining and waxing and such.

I finished the first two by following what I thought was the accepted procedure (however, I could be horribly wrong): polish with brown tripoli, final coat of Fiebing's, buff with white diamond, apply carnauba with a flannel wheel and hand-polish. After smoking a few times I was left with some stain on my hands. Did I do something wrong that stain is coming off when I smoke it?

And a second question to go along with it. The finish wasn't as shiny as I had hoped, so in reading some older posts I saw it mentioned that "spit coats" of shellac are used to have a greater shine but I could not find a description of what a "spit coat" is. Can someone explain them to me and where they fit into the polishing, staining, buffing and waxing procedure? Thanks once again for your help.

[SimeonTurner]

Hi Nathan-

As far as the stain coming off...I would suggest that you not apply any more dye after the tripoli. That's probably all you are having trouble with there. Stain it up to whatever grit you finally sand to, then trip, white diamond, carnuba, Todd's spit/urine, and you're good (maybe skip that last step).

As for a spit coat, basically it is a thin layer of shellac (usually cut pretty thin), applied and then immediately wiped off before it dries. It's a source of controversy, but those who use it like it, and it's purpose is really to set your stain and leave it ready with a nice hard surface for buffing. (Shellac could also help you with your stain rubbing off issue).

[Sasquatch]

Controversy?

Fukkinell, buddy, just send em to me for educatin.

[NathanA]

I am assuming that you are not talking about spray shellac and when you say "cut very thin" does that mean diluted with alcohol? Also the spit coat comes after the wax? Does that make it the final step in the finishing process?

[SimeonTurner]

Sorry, let me clarify.

I'm not referring to spray on shellac, though some folks have used that with success in certain situations (especially with rusticated pipes). I'm referring to either shellac flakes that are purchased in solid form and then "cut" to varying levels of dilution using denatured alcohol, or even canned shellac (pre-mixed) that is also "cut" with denatured alcohol. It is then applied AFTER staining but BEFORE buffing/waxing.

Of course, lots of guys have their own little trade secret tricks and half-steps in addition to this, but the general premise is as listed above.

I'm pretty sure there was a relatively recent thread around here about cutting shellac for our purposes. Poke around a bit and you'll find it.

[KurtHuhn]

That's the basic premise, yes. But very few pros are willing to discuss such things in great detail until they can be certain the person asking is serious about making pipes. And even then, usually not in publicly visible parts of the forum.

[SimeonTurner]

Yep. In fact, just for using the word shellac in the forum, I have had to stick three briar shards under my left eyelid in pennance.

It's a tough little club we have here. Kinda like the shriners, only without the cool hats.

[ToddJohnson]

It's a tough little club we have here. Kinda like the shriners, only without the cool hats.

You didn't get your hat?

TJ

[NathanA]

Well thanks for the advice. I hope I didn't step on any toes with the shellac thing. I was mainly trying to solve the stain problem.

[SimeonTurner]

It's a tough little club we have here. Kinda like the shriners, only without the cool hats.

You didn't get your hat?

TJ

Well, I got a hat made of Kurts leather pants when I signed up. But remember, I said we don't have cool hats.

[T3pipes]

I can't call this advice, I'm still experimenting/learning, so let's call it general observations.

Heating the wood with a heat gun has allowed more stain to be absorbed after sanding with grits over 320.

A spit coat can cause the stain to run if the stain has not been absorbed into the wood.

Keeping the wood in small jar of stain overnight did not cause the stain to absorb any deeper than a normal application. (tested on small pieces after various levels of sanding)

After 400 grit, wiping the pipe down with denatured alcohol removes a lot of the stain, but sometimes it doesn't.

The rim tends to absorb less stain than the rest of the pipe. I believe this may be because of my staining method, and trying to avoid getting stain in the bowl.

After I cut the wood to a pipe-ish shape on the band-saw, I sand and stain a piece of the cast off wood to get an idea of how that piece absorbs the stain.

And to save you some heartache--
Brown trip will transfer to your pipe if it is overloaded.
Stain will transfer to your buffing pad if it is not absorbed well. Wiping the pipe off with a dry cloth will not guarantee that it won't transfer, but any that ends up on the cloth would have been on your buffing wheel.
Denatured alcohol will cause dye from leather work gloves to bleed onto your wood. 2 ground off fingernails is worse than trying to remove some stain from a pipe.

[NathanA]

Mr. Turner and T3,
Thank you for all the advice and hints. I will keep it all in mind as I am finishing my latest. I posted some pics of the rough shaping in another thread. I would love to hear your comments.