ugly ebonite

[pennsyscot]

I purchased 1 meter of ebonite from a new supplier. I was enticed by a very low price. I just used the first bit of it on my last pipe and I'm not pleased. Previously I have used ebonite from PME and have had no problems. This material I have not been able to get a good finish. The surface is covered with tiny little pits. I have resanded and buffed, but the pits remain. I also found it very difficult to remove scratch marks from previous grits. This stem is afixed to my no. 17 posted in the gallery. Has anyone else had similar experiences? Is there any chance the rest of the rod may be good? I would like to hear your thoughts.

[Leus]

Do you have comparison pictures of it? Some time ago I got a shipment of rods and I've never been too happy with it. Extremely unforgiving stuff.

[ToddJohnson]

No, the rest of the rod will not be good. With cast rod--like Bakelite--sometimes there's crap in the ends and good material in the center, but Ebonite is extruded, so the stuff on the ends is the same as what's in the middle. The problems you're having actually working the material are a function of it being too soft. My guess is that putting a mirror edge on it with a cutting tool was nigh unto impossible as well. The tiny bubbles--apologies to Don Ho--are also going to run throughout the material. I've experienced this before from only one supplier. When I'm into a bad rod, I know it from the first pass with a tool. I just take it out of the chuck, mark the whole rod "BAD," and grab another rod. I know this supplier has been very cooperative in replacing sub standard stock for other pipemakers, but you never get the time back.

TJ

[d6monk]

You guys mind posting or messaging me who these suppliers are. I'm about ready to order a bunch of ebonite, so...

Also, who are some good suppliers you would recommend? I have a hard time finding the stuff sometimes (esp. in larger diameters--I haven't found anything more than like 1.25").

[Sasquatch]

I just got a rod from PME and it is different than the previous ones I've seen. Smoother and ... lighter? Will post more if anything comes of it.

[Charl]

Just as a matter of interest: what diameter rod (for rookies like me who can't afford 10 at a time) would you clever guys say is the most "generic"? Or put another way: what thickness would give me the best deal for my money?

[KurtHuhn]

I usually get 20mm and 22mm raw (not sanded smooth) rod. That seems to work for the bulk of pipes I make. I have a small supply of 16mm, but I don't use it often.

[Sasquatch]

Agree w/Kurt. I think I buy 22 most of the time. Fatter is too expensive/wasteful for the average pipe, and skinnier makes for girlie wuss pipes and I can't abide that.

[KurtHuhn]

Definitely no wussy pipes here.

[SimeonTurner]

Note to self...hide the 12mm ebonite if/when sasquatch and Kurt come over to the shop...

[d6monk]

Man, unless it's just a regular tapered or saddle bit stem (no flares or other kind of creative shaping) 25mm is the smallest I can go, and I still have problems every other pipe. I have a bunch of stummels just waiting till I can get my hands on some 2-3" stock. 12mm ebonite? It's like I'm living in a different world.

[KurtHuhn]

Man, unless it's just a regular tapered or saddle bit stem (no flares or other kind of creative shaping) 25mm is the smallest I can go, and I still have problems every other pipe. I have a bunch of stummels just waiting till I can get my hands on some 2-3" stock. 12mm ebonite? It's like I'm living in a different world.

How effing big are your pipes?!

[SimeonTurner]

I really focus on the leprechaun demographic. It's a niche market.






P.S. To clarify, I don't use 12mm ebonite. I was trying to make a funny. My jokes are even worse than my pipes, apparently.

[kbadkar]

I have a 1/2" diameter rod, but it's long.

[Sasquatch]

Mine's not real long, but it's way thicker than Kris's.

[SimeonTurner]

See, you guys made a funny! How do you DO it? I may start a thread asking for tips. Better yet, Kurt, could you create a whole sub forum dedicated to tipsnon how to be funnier on the forum?

[Mike Messer]

You guys mind posting or messaging me who these suppliers are. I'm about ready to order a bunch of ebonite, so...

Also, who are some good suppliers you would recommend? I have a hard time finding the stuff sometimes (esp. in larger diameters--I haven't found anything more than like 1.25").

You can buy direct from SEM, posibly the best manufacturer, and any size you want, big blocks even. Go to their web site: http://www.sem-hitzacker.de/ Email them a request for a price list. There is about a 35 Euro ($50) extra charge if you buy less than 35 meters at one time, but their prices are better than many suppliers, so you can come out okay, depending. My price list is about 6 months old, but 22 mm was $40 per meter, then. PME's price would be $88 per meter. So, do the math. The only thing SEM is lacking is classic Cumberland which is, I think, different from the SEM cumberland "marbled" which is a spiral swirl of color. Not sure?

[ToddJohnson]

You guys mind posting or messaging me who these suppliers are. I'm about ready to order a bunch of ebonite, so...

Also, who are some good suppliers you would recommend? I have a hard time finding the stuff sometimes (esp. in larger diameters--I haven't found anything more than like 1.25").

You can buy direct from SEM, posibly the best manufacturer, and any size you want, big blocks even. Go to their web site. Email them a request for a price list. There is ab out a 35 Euro ($50) extra charge if you buy less than 35 meters at one time, but their prices are better than many suppliers, so you can come out okay, depending. My price list is about 6 months old, but 22 mm was $40 per meter, then. PME's price would be $88 per meter. The only thing SEM is lacking is classic Cumberland which is, I think, is different from the SEM cumberland "marbled" which is a spiral swirl of color. Not sure?

Before buying from SEM, I would ask around and make sure she's worked all the color and consistency problems out. The stuff I got in Chicago had a brown haze about 3mm. deep and much of it had micro-inclusions and was too soft. As I understand it, many of these problems have been worked out, but I've been using so much Bakelite that I haven't really followed up with the other guys to make sure. FWIW, I intend to talk with Mieke in Chicago and probably buy more.

TJ

[caskwith]

You guys mind posting or messaging me who these suppliers are. I'm about ready to order a bunch of ebonite, so...

Also, who are some good suppliers you would recommend? I have a hard time finding the stuff sometimes (esp. in larger diameters--I haven't found anything more than like 1.25").

You can buy direct from SEM, posibly the best manufacturer, and any size you want, big blocks even. Go to their web site. Email them a request for a price list. There is ab out a 35 Euro ($50) extra charge if you buy less than 35 meters at one time, but their prices are better than many suppliers, so you can come out okay, depending. My price list is about 6 months old, but 22 mm was $40 per meter, then. PME's price would be $88 per meter. The only thing SEM is lacking is classic Cumberland which is, I think, is different from the SEM cumberland "marbled" which is a spiral swirl of color. Not sure?

Before buying from SEM, I would ask around and make sure she's worked all the color and consistency problems out. The stuff I got in Chicago had a brown haze about 3mm. deep and much of it had micro-inclusions and was too soft. As I understand it, many of these problems have been worked out, but I've been using so much Bakelite that I haven't really followed up with the other guys to make sure. FWIW, I intend to talk with Mieke in Chicago and probably buy more.

TJ

Paul and I had samples of the older stuff, i still have a semi made stem in the workshop actually. It was a bit crappy like you say, it was very sft and easily scratched and the colours were very muddy looking, the red/black was more just shades of red rather than defined colours. Recently however Paul put in a big order of which i had about half, the new stuff is so much better, the colours are more defined and less muddy looking, the rods are nice and hard and they finish up really well. I have got rods of ebonite, blue/black, yellow/black, and green/black and they are all very good. The only rod i didnt order was the red/black as i prefer the classic cumberland patterning for this.
Obviously this doesnt gurantee all the problems are sorted however so I have tried a piece of each ord and they are all good and Paul hasnt mentioned any problems with his batch either.

Hope that helps some people.

[Mike Messer]

Before buying from SEM, I would ask around and make sure she's...

Where you been, Todd? (I know where you been) You know that's a crock. In context it's just pure slander. You started this BS, and I suggest you end it, It's counterproductive.
M.M.

Back to the subject...
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Sem-Hitzacker.de

From: meike.huijssen@sem-hitzacker.de
Sat, 15 Aug 2009 06:37:32 +0200

.... I suggest you heard about our quality from other pipemakers. We developed about 3 years to have a perfect product. Pipemakers like Larry Roush, Barby, Teddy Knudsen, Rafa Martin, Love Geiger, Trever Talbert, Moritz, Tsuge are using our product and gave us best comments.

Warm regards
Meike Huijssen
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As for Todd's Bakelite substitute, I really like the Bakelite, too. It looks great, but its made from phenol and formaldehyde and I have some toxcicity issues with it. I'm not saying it's toxic. I'm saying I just don't know?
And while the Bakelite is an interesting, novel, change-of-pace material, I feel reasonably sure it will not replace ebonite and acrylic as the primary tip material for tobacco pipes.

I've been thinking about going back to making stems from wood, like the Native Americans, not seriously, but all of the chemical formulations seem to be potentially toxic, and any one of them can be formulated in, literally, an infinite number of different ways, and the sources and resellers are vague as hell, with some refusing to tell you who made it or what it is, and I kind-of like to know what I'm working with. If I sell a pipe to somebody, and he smokes it, I want to know that it's good, not to mention the legal liability, if it isn't. I really hate bringing this subject up, but I guess I could just use the, "Well, PME wouldn't say who made it, but they said it was good," defense.
Maybe not.