pipemakersforum.com

A couple of questions from the annoying newbie:

1) Can someone explain to me or point me to an explanation of the Dunhill group sizes? I am assuming it is based on chamber size but I could be horribly wrong about that.

and

2) Is it inappropriate to try and copy a pipe of someone else's making? In the pipe alchemy sticky, it is mentioned how important it is to first be able to make a pretty pipe before trying to innovate. I imagine no one would have a problem copying a factory Stanwell, Peterson or Savinelli design, but is it bad form to copy an individual's design, say a Todd or a Kurt or a Tyler or a Rad? I am years away from attempting to sell a pipe so profit is certainly not an issue, but I see so many beautiful pipes I am tempted to try and copy some in order to understand what makes their pipes so good but I certainly wouldn't want to offend anyone. Just a little pipe theology food for thought.

You can copy any of my pipes that you want. Hell, Kurt does.

Rad

Copy this Todd pipe!

I think it's a bit simplified to say that anyone could pop out a factory shape... I think a lot of people here would miss be significant amounts on any number of shapes (myself included). And I think that's a hugely importantly step in learning to make ANY pipes.

I've directly copied a number of pipes, and the fact is, mine didn't look exactly like the original anyhow.

So whip out the Nordh-style Ballerina and see if anyone calls you a copycat or not, I guess!

Just my .02

i doubt that anyone but a few notable exceptions have made a truly original pipe in quite some time.

RadDavis wrote:You can copy any of my pipes that you want. Hell, Kurt does.

Guilty as charged! I mean, if you're going to copy somebody's pipes, Rad is a great choice.

Well, I don't know about "copy", but I certainly am influenced by Rad's pipes - as I am by Trever, Jeff, and Todd's, as well as many other makers. And I think that's kind of how it goes for a lot of artisans no matter what their craft. I do try, however, to inject my own aesthetic - I don't want to make perfect copies, more like interpretations.

Kind of like when I brew beer. I'm influenced by Cantillon, Hoegarden, Smithwicks, Tadcaster, Stone, Allagash, and a whole pile of other breweries. However, I'm always finding something different that I would do to each, like late boil hop additions, or wet hops, sweet orange instead of bitter, or even oaking in some cases.

Actually, come to think of it, the only pipe I ever truly tried to copy was a Savinelli 101 billiard. Didn't quite succeed either.

If you look at any art form, you see artists of similar periods using similar techniques and making efforts at similar concepts. Unless you are trying to counterfeit someone's work (like say, making a lovely high-heel-shaped-craziness-pipe and then selling it as a "Todd Johnson Original"), I don't think you are very likely to have done anything wrong. That said, if there are makers who have a sort of signature shape (Love's logo shape comes to mind), I would think it would be bad form to try to imitate it exactly.

Imitation is usually a wonderful form of flattery.

As for Dunhill sizes, I believe they refer to the overall size of the pipe, not the chamber size.

I would say copy away, if you plan to keep it. If you want to sell it, then you should not try to create an exact replica (not that this is easy!) but use the original as an inspiration, and publicly state so.

Cheers!

Thanks for the responses. First of all let me say that in no way do I think myself capable of copying a factory or an individuals pipe. My skills are far too rudimentary for me to think I can just whip out a copy of someones masterpiece. My point was that the shapes and designs I feel most drawn to are from many of the craftsmen on this site and it makes me want to attempt something similar so I can maybe figure out what makes theirs so much better than mine. Believe me, no one has anything to worry about. There is no way I could even come close to any of those guys at this point in my pipe making odyssey.

Anyone on the Dunhill group sizes?

here is a discussion on that topic in a different forum:

http://christianpipesmokers.net/modules ... c&p=295863

When you say copy of someones pipe, how do we know that the person didn't copy it from someone else who copied it from someone else?

It is ok to copy. One really can't make the same pipe twice anyway. Wood grain, color, etc.
is will likely be different.

Most all great makers of art at some time learned their craft by copying from other masters.

Atrist, sculpters, painters, pipemakers, violin makers, etc. all done dooed it.

What better practice is there but to try to duplicate a masters piece.

Patrick wrote:
What better practice is there but to try to duplicate a masters piece.

Exactly.

What I like to do is take elements from several different pipes and combine them to make something a little more unique. Try copying the majority of a certain pipe, but do something like changing the stem style (possibly borrowed from another pipe) or give it a different degree of bend or something like that. You have something to work with and you get a chance to be a little creative.

The trick is lots of sketching. Create frankenpipes on paper, and then see what works and what doesn't.

I have one of those flip books, like kids have? Where you have the head of one animal, body of another and tail of a third. Except mine has bowl, shank and stem. I just toss the book in the air and make what comes up.

Actually, its not really a bad idea...