I actually turned a tenon

marks · Post by **marks** » Mon Oct 25, 2004 9:20 pm

I turned my first tenon, and wonder of all wonders, it fits.

I still prefer delrin, but I figured I needed to be able to turn a tenon if I wanted to call myself a pipemaker.

RadDavis · Post by **RadDavis** » Tue Oct 26, 2004 12:11 am

Hi Mark,

I'm not sure I understand. Don't you have to turn delrin also?

Rad

Post by **KurtHuhn** » Tue Oct 26, 2004 10:32 am

Not if you buy the right size.

RadDavis · Post by **RadDavis** » Tue Oct 26, 2004 11:35 am

So back to my question:

I've never used delrin. Do you buy the right size and insert that somehow ito the stem to make a tenon? I'm just trying to visualize the mechanics of the process.

Rad

Post by **Tyler** » Tue Oct 26, 2004 12:16 pm

random,

I think that most delrin tenons are bought to the size that the mortise that is drilled. That is one of the benefits of delrin. It makes for a much faster build time for me, since I am so bad at turning tenons.

If you are having trouble drilling the hole to match the size of the hole with the diameter of the rod, I would suggest that there is some slop in the drilling proces that is "wallowing" out the hole a bit.

Tyler

Post by **KurtHuhn** » Tue Oct 26, 2004 1:24 pm

My experience, such as it is, is that a 5/16" delrin rod with fit "just right" in a 5/16" hole in briar. Never had a problem. I don't know if that's widespread or not, but the experiences of delrin tenons I've heard and read tend to be similar.

jeff · Post by **jeff** » Tue Oct 26, 2004 2:55 pm

random wrote: Next time you drill one of those 5/16 holes in briar Kurt, stick the smooth end of the bit in and see how well it fits, would you please? I suspect you'll find it fits very tightly, maybe too tightly to press in by hand.

I've never had a problem with this procedure. Putting the smooth end of the drill bit into the mortise I just drilled with it is something that I do with every stummel I shape. Maybe your drill bits are off.

Jeff

jeff · Post by **jeff** » Tue Oct 26, 2004 2:58 pm

Tyler,

Have you started using Delrin tenons exclusively? If so, I wasn't aware of it. What is your reasoning behind this? From what I have heard, I know that a lot of high-grade pipemakers resist using them because they are less likely to break than a vulcanite or acrylic tenon. They want the tenon to run the risk of breaking so that in the case of a dropped pipe the tenon will break off before the shank cracks or snaps. I'm curious to hear your reasoning.

Jeff

Post by **Tyler** » Tue Oct 26, 2004 4:33 pm

I don't use Delrin exclsively. In fact, I use it rarely.

I use Delrin:

1. When I am feeling lazy (no turning), AND
2. when the stem design will work with a delrin tenon, AND
3. when the shank is a match for delrin.

So far, that has amounted to maybe 5% of my pipes, maybe less. Most recently, I did it for the pipe I am keeping that that I have photos of in the "Buy, Sell, Trade" section. All of the above lined up, and I was able to save myself about 30 minutes. It was an easy decision since this was a keeper for me.

I am not trying to make a move to Delrin, though I will likely continue to use it on occassion.

Tyler

jeff · Post by **jeff** » Tue Oct 26, 2004 5:09 pm

That helps, thanks! You've redeemed yourself.

Jeff

marks · Post by **marks** » Tue Oct 26, 2004 9:13 pm

My experience has been using 5/16 delrin and drilling a 5/16 mortise. When taking off the stem of any of my pipes there is no chattering, squeaking, or other problems that I have experienced with turned tenons on pipes I have bought. There is some variation between pipes, but none have been too loose or too tight at the mortise/tenon joint.

Regarding the discussion about bits, etc. the reason I had to turn this tenon is that I used an end mill to finish the mortise on this block, and the end mill was off. The diameter was just right, but if you laid the end mill on its side and rolled, it was clearly evident that the reamer was warped, just like a billiard cue. It was only off slightly, but it was off, so I returned it and got a reamer instead (Jim Cooke had recommended using a reamer).

The reamer has been working very well. I drill the mortise with a slightly smaller drill bit, then unhook the belt on the drill press, chuck the reamer, and turn the chuck by hand while advancing the chuck. This has yielded the most consistent results yet in the fit of the delrin in the mortise. There may be better methods, but this has been working for me so far.

I'm still glad I learned how to turn a tenon, though. Good discussion here.

RadDavis · Post by **RadDavis** » Tue Oct 26, 2004 11:25 pm

I had a question in there somewhere. I posted it twice. Did anybody notice it? Am I being ignored for some reason?

Rad

jeff · Post by **jeff** » Tue Oct 26, 2004 11:43 pm

Rad,

As I understand the process, basically, you drill out your stem material to make a short mortise of the same size as the delrin rod. You rough up that mortise and the delrin tenon and epoxy it into place. The result will be a delrin tenon in a stem of your choice of materials.

There are more thorough and knowledgeable descriptions of this process elsewhere on the site. I'm sure if you do a search or browse through the stem threads that you will find your answer.

Jeff

RadDavis · Post by **RadDavis** » Wed Oct 27, 2004 11:25 am

What?! You want me to do the work?

Thanks, Jeff. Like I said I've never used delrin, and I wanted to know what the process was.

I've watched Mark Tinsky use delrin for repairing a broken tenon, but wasn't sure if the process was the same when using it as part of an original stem.

Your explanation was clear enough that I don't have to search.

Thanks again,

Rad

BTW, Random, I showered and put on fresh deodorant just this morning.

marks · Post by **marks** » Wed Oct 27, 2004 1:17 pm

Opps!

Sorry Rad, I completely missed your question. How I attach the delrin to the stem is as follows

Drill a mortise in the stem blank (I will vary the length depending on the final anticipated shape of the stem)
Cut and drill an airway in a piece of delrin
Cut the angle at the end of the delrin to the same angle as the drill bit used to drill the mortise
Cut a groove on the outside of the delrin and one on the inside of the mortise so the epoxy will have something to hold onto (that delrin is slippery stuff)
Fill the grooves with epoxy, then put some on the flat surfaces
Insert the delrin in the mortise
Let the epoxy dry
Drill out the dried epoxy from the airway
Trim the excess delrin to length

Hope this is clears things up.

RadDavis · Post by **RadDavis** » Wed Oct 27, 2004 5:53 pm

Hi Mark,

Thanks for the reply.

Did cutting a tenon save you some time over using delrin?

Rad