guys... regards,
i have bought the metal box (container) for collecting dust from a firplace - it is a metal box that can be connected to the vacuum cleaner and used to clean the fireplace...
i plan to put a small homemade cyclone separator on that container but i have issues with engine that will move the air...
i tried using the workshop fan (big, old unit with 30cm in dia) that is perfect for collecting dust from the workshop air but it is simply not enough (not enough power to suck the dust from the collecting "spoon") when using with the setup i wanted to use it with (dust collector - flexi tube - cyclone separator (that i still have to make) - dust container - flexi tube - fan)...
i would need someone to tell me what to use that is small, effective and has low power consumption (if possible) that will be able to solve my problem.... my space is very limited and i have some room under the drillpress and above it...
will post pictures later today... thank you
dust removing setup - HELP needed..!!!!!
Re: dust removing setup - HELP needed..!!!!!
Honestly, no "fan" will ever have the power required for the job, period. Regular bladed fans do not provide enough static pressure to push air through a small orifice, nor can they pull through it. A "squirrel cage fan" (forgot the proper name) will do slightly better, but will still lack heavily.
Your best bet for a small system is a shop-vac with a Thien Baffle in a 5-gallon bucket. Forget the cyclone idea, they add far too much static pressure and need a ton of flow to work properly. A Thien Baffle is what you want, just trust me on this one. I've tried both.
But, if you plan to use this for dust collection while sanding, you will soon surpass the capabilities of a shop-vac. They just don't pull the needed air. They collect chips well, dust, not so much.
Read this article: http://billpentz.com/woodworking/cyclone/index.cfm
Then go here: http://www.cgallery.com/jpthien/cy.htm
I think you will see a small dedicated dust collector will be closer to what you need. And by small, I mean 1 to 1.5hp minimum. A large shop-vac may be OK if you have a good exhaust system sucking in clean air, but it won't do all that well by itself.
I've run through plenty of different scenarios myself, trying to be cheap. I now have a 2hp 1250cfm collector sucking through a Thien Baffle on top of a 35gallon trash can. It's best to just do it right the first time, you'll save money in the long run.
If you can't exhaust the air for some reason (neighbors, etc), build a good air filter to clean the shop's air.
Good luck
Kenny
Your best bet for a small system is a shop-vac with a Thien Baffle in a 5-gallon bucket. Forget the cyclone idea, they add far too much static pressure and need a ton of flow to work properly. A Thien Baffle is what you want, just trust me on this one. I've tried both.
But, if you plan to use this for dust collection while sanding, you will soon surpass the capabilities of a shop-vac. They just don't pull the needed air. They collect chips well, dust, not so much.
Read this article: http://billpentz.com/woodworking/cyclone/index.cfm
Then go here: http://www.cgallery.com/jpthien/cy.htm
I think you will see a small dedicated dust collector will be closer to what you need. And by small, I mean 1 to 1.5hp minimum. A large shop-vac may be OK if you have a good exhaust system sucking in clean air, but it won't do all that well by itself.
I've run through plenty of different scenarios myself, trying to be cheap. I now have a 2hp 1250cfm collector sucking through a Thien Baffle on top of a 35gallon trash can. It's best to just do it right the first time, you'll save money in the long run.
If you can't exhaust the air for some reason (neighbors, etc), build a good air filter to clean the shop's air.
Good luck
Kenny
Re: dust removing setup - HELP needed..!!!!!
Kenny - thanks...
i will read your post and links carefully....
in the mean time here is what i tried and it does not work good (pictures bellow)...
the "spoon" that collects dust works fine... when i use an old vacuum cleaner on a minimum power it works perfectly but most of the dust ends up in the vacuum cleaner... so, i need something (if using this setup with a vacuum cleaner or some kind of fan) that will remove dust from the air... or another system that will use what i have now and remove dust....
i can't exhaust dust out of the workshop without filtering it into something - my mother will "kill" me because it will end up in her flower garden......
i will read your post and links carefully....
in the mean time here is what i tried and it does not work good (pictures bellow)...
the "spoon" that collects dust works fine... when i use an old vacuum cleaner on a minimum power it works perfectly but most of the dust ends up in the vacuum cleaner... so, i need something (if using this setup with a vacuum cleaner or some kind of fan) that will remove dust from the air... or another system that will use what i have now and remove dust....
i can't exhaust dust out of the workshop without filtering it into something - my mother will "kill" me because it will end up in her flower garden......
Re: dust removing setup - HELP needed..!!!!!
A small wall hanging dust collector (like this: http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page ... te=ROCKLER ) should work just fine. But make a Thien Baffle to act as a pre-filter.
As for the ash can, I'm willing to bet is has a bunch of filters that will kill airflow. It's not what I would use.
Like I said, a large shop-vac might work, but you need a lot of air-flow for effective dust collection, no other way about it. If you read the Bill Pentz article I linked to above, you'll understand why (it's too involved for me to write out here).
As an extra measure, use the exhaust fan that you had ducted to (without the ducting) for some extra help. If dust creates an issue, build a small box in front of it and add a furnace filter to it. Now this is only to expel air from the shop and catch whatever airborne dust your main collector doesn't catch, not to act as a means of dust collection. Basically, unless you go with a powerful collection system, you will need help clearing the air of what your main collection system misses.
Dust collection is one area where you really can't skimp and still get good results, it just doesn't happen.
Myself, I would prefer 4" hose with a minimum of 650cfm of flow. A shop vac won't do that, but it will have more static pressure than a dust collector blower, so it still may work.
I'll put it to you this way, I run a 1250cfm collector with a 5-micron bag iand pre-filter it with a Thien Baffle on top of a 35gallon trash can. I have a pretty decent scoop around my sanding disc, as well as at my lathe, drill press, table-saw, router and most other machinery. I also do most sanding over a down-draft table.
That said, the pre-filter on my air-filter (a stand-alone unit hung from the ceiling) still needs the pre-filter cleaned once a week, and the main filter changed every other week. So that should give you an idea of the dust my system misses, even as powerful as it is.
Another huge help would be to use a 20" box fan with a 20"x20" furnace filter attached to the inlet side as an air filter. It will help remove what your system misses. It's cheap, simple, and works well. And you don't need to bother with making something to hold the filter on. Just tape it on with wide masking tape, it works fine like that.
Your best help will come from reading the articles I linked to. It's explains a ton of different areas in great detail. But, unless you plan to build a 1250+cfm system, I would forget about the cyclone. They need a ton of flow to effectively filter the air (like they were designed anyway)
As for the ash can, I'm willing to bet is has a bunch of filters that will kill airflow. It's not what I would use.
Like I said, a large shop-vac might work, but you need a lot of air-flow for effective dust collection, no other way about it. If you read the Bill Pentz article I linked to above, you'll understand why (it's too involved for me to write out here).
As an extra measure, use the exhaust fan that you had ducted to (without the ducting) for some extra help. If dust creates an issue, build a small box in front of it and add a furnace filter to it. Now this is only to expel air from the shop and catch whatever airborne dust your main collector doesn't catch, not to act as a means of dust collection. Basically, unless you go with a powerful collection system, you will need help clearing the air of what your main collection system misses.
Dust collection is one area where you really can't skimp and still get good results, it just doesn't happen.
Myself, I would prefer 4" hose with a minimum of 650cfm of flow. A shop vac won't do that, but it will have more static pressure than a dust collector blower, so it still may work.
I'll put it to you this way, I run a 1250cfm collector with a 5-micron bag iand pre-filter it with a Thien Baffle on top of a 35gallon trash can. I have a pretty decent scoop around my sanding disc, as well as at my lathe, drill press, table-saw, router and most other machinery. I also do most sanding over a down-draft table.
That said, the pre-filter on my air-filter (a stand-alone unit hung from the ceiling) still needs the pre-filter cleaned once a week, and the main filter changed every other week. So that should give you an idea of the dust my system misses, even as powerful as it is.
Another huge help would be to use a 20" box fan with a 20"x20" furnace filter attached to the inlet side as an air filter. It will help remove what your system misses. It's cheap, simple, and works well. And you don't need to bother with making something to hold the filter on. Just tape it on with wide masking tape, it works fine like that.
Your best help will come from reading the articles I linked to. It's explains a ton of different areas in great detail. But, unless you plan to build a 1250+cfm system, I would forget about the cyclone. They need a ton of flow to effectively filter the air (like they were designed anyway)
Re: dust removing setup - HELP needed..!!!!!
Kenny - thanks...
i read the articles....
i will go for Thien separator for sure... cyclone separator is not something i can use here as you noted clearly... i don't have that airflow...
thank you dear Sir...
best regards, daniel
i read the articles....
i will go for Thien separator for sure... cyclone separator is not something i can use here as you noted clearly... i don't have that airflow...
thank you dear Sir...
best regards, daniel
Re: dust removing setup - HELP needed..!!!!!
This is the result - it is not finished yet... i will install a new fan and a cloth bag to filter the dust rurther and remove the vacuum cleaner ... but i am happy - it works really good
