Help/Words of wisdom

[cmueller]

Hello everyone,

Over the holidays I was visiting Wingenroth Pipe Shop, which is where I first started selling my pipes and I started to come to the realization that if I continue to make pipes as a hobbyist I would still be making pipes as a hobby for years to come. I also started to realize that if I was intending on buying a pipe that day I would need to buy my own since the factory ones and the couple artesian pipes all had issues from off set button holes to poor drilling to name a few.

I recently started selling my pipes in the UK at Smoke King in Yorkshire and so far they have been well received. Lately, the owner of that shop and my family have been encouraging me to at least make pipes part time to start and see where it goes. I know this will take some work and more tooling to make things faster but I am trying to avoid mistakes if possible. If anyone could give me some advice or be able to give me a call so I can pick your brain that would be great. I know I will need a lathe to speed things up and a blaster/compressor since they are popular, a web page, and I need to attend shows but I am unsure of all the rest, especially taxes.

Thanks in advance

[cmueller]

Anyone? Haha, you guys can pm me if that's easier.

[callous49]

There are several things to consider when trying to start your own shop. I’m a newbie on this site but I wanted to wish you good luck and if I offer any advice it would be to don’t let the the business structure overwhelm your craftsmanship.

My wife has a glass shop making stained glass pieces and lamp work beads. She had to get a business license and sells mostly on Ebay and does some custom work. I know taxes and shipping very and then there is always The IRS.

[Alden]

Not sure exactly what you're asking? Should you take it to the next level ?
If thats the question, probably you are the best judge of that.
If its my advice, I say yeah if your heart is in it and your budget will allow it.

[Alden]

And as far as good advice goes, do not underestimate the numbers. You will SPEND way more than you think. And you will MAKE way less than you think.
Once you've figured out how much money you will spend on tools, triple it.
Once you've figured out how much money you will make, divide that by 3.
As long as you skew those numbers in the proper directions you will be fine

[cmueller]

Thanks guys

[Tyler]

Hard to answer for you.

If you sell any, it's already "part time." So I guess what you mean is you would cut back on the day job? I don't know man, how much are you hoping to make? Realize, it's one thing to sell ten or fifteen a year, and another to sell eighty. All of a sudden selling them becomes as much work as making them, unless you have a LOT of friends lined up to buy pipes.

[caskwith]

Do you really, really love pipe making, is it the best hobby you have ever found and you cannot resist the urge to get out in the workshop? If so then KEEP it a hobby.
Pipe making full time or even part time is very rewarding and I can certainly say it's the best job I have ever had, but things change when you start to rely on it for paying bills, some people can handle those changes, some people can't. Regardless though you will never look at pipe making in the same way again.

[d.huber]

Do you really, really love pipe making, is it the best hobby you have ever found and you cannot resist the urge to get out in the workshop? If so then KEEP it a hobby.
Pipe making full time or even part time is very rewarding and I can certainly say it's the best job I have ever had, but things change when you start to rely on it for paying bills, some people can handle those changes, some people can't. Regardless though you will never look at pipe making in the same way again.

Words to heed.

This is something I struggle with. Pipemaking as a hobby is very rewarding and offers me a wonderful respite from the daily grind. I want to spend more time in the shop, but once I had it, would I appreciate it as much? I believe so, but I don't really know. It's a question that haunts me.

My first artistic career was as a sound designer/engineer for live theatre. I made a pretty decent lower-middle class income doing that. It was my full time job and at first I was very happy. After about 3 years, it began to wear on me and after 5 I quit. There are plenty of factors involved here and it's those factors that you've got to be honest with yourself about. For me, the thing that wore me down was being unable to collaborate in the way I wanted to. Commercial theatre can be incredibly vacuous, especially when you're in situations where directors find it easier to tell you what to create instead of allowing you to create or guiding your creative energy. Eventually, the constant occurrence of circumstances like that make the creative process truly a job because it's only creative in-so-far as you're trying to figure out how to make something that will please your boss.

All that being said, be honest with yourself and what your goals are. Look forward and ask yourself the hard questions about what you want, especially if this would be a move away from another full time job. Make your choice based upon what you want, not what they want. If you decide to keep doing it in your spare time (already part-time, like Tyler said), then they'll continue to buy them and sell them at a comfortable rate and no one will be the worse for the wear.

Demand is a beautiful thing. Flooding the market can be dangerous.

[sam a]

you might find these articles helpful.

http://tobaccodays.com/blurbs/what-is-t ... rs-to-use/

http://tobaccodays.com/blurbs/the-fears ... pe-makers/

http://tobaccodays.com/blurbs/with-the- ... tors-take/

[d.huber]

Great articles, Sam. I need to visit his site more often.

[LatakiaLover]

My first artistic career was as a sound designer/engineer for live theatre. I made a pretty decent lower-middle class income doing that. It was my full time job and at first I was very happy. After about 3 years, it began to wear on me and after 5 I quit. There are plenty of factors involved here and it's those factors that you've got to be honest with yourself about. For me, the thing that wore me down was being unable to collaborate in the way I wanted to. Commercial theatre can be incredibly vacuous, especially when you're in situations where directors find it easier to tell you what to create instead of allowing you to create or guiding your creative energy. Eventually, the constant occurrence of circumstances like that make the creative process truly a job because it's only creative in-so-far as you're trying to figure out how to make something that will please your boss.

Indeed. I was in the IT field for quite a while, and we had a verbal shorthand for it: "Programming is fun; being a programmer sucks"

[LittleBill]

One of the most important questions you can ask yourself is, "What's the worst that can happen?" Spend a lot of time answering it for yourself, discussing with family, etc. Can you absorb the financial loss if your investment in new tools and in time goes completely belly up? Are you willing to run the risk of hating something you currently love? If you sacrifice your regular job and want it back, is that possible? Can your regular job be replaced with something that provides as it does now?

On the flip side, how are you prepared to deal with success? Do you have plans to grow a business to accommodate more volume? How about continued learning to increase your skill set? How will success affect your family and social life?

Turning a hobby into a business comes with some other issues. There are guys who are pure hobby woodworkers who get to spend more time in their shops than I do because I have all the other aspects of running a business to attend to. If you are going to go into business, you have to love the idea of running a business as much as you do making pipes. No one else is going to run it for you. You may get some help along the way, but there is a lot of drudgery that goes on behind the scenes.

These are just some of the questions to ask yourself. I made the decision almost 22 years ago to turn my woodworking hobby into a business. It went very well, but not a lot of people are able to say that. Over the course of that time I have talked or corresponded with many people who wanted to do the same thing. It ain't about sitting in your shop and making stuff. There is a whole lot of other stuff that goes into it. Good luck with your pursuit, however you decide to pursue it.

[Sasquatch]

Every time I've seen an opportunity to ramp up my production, I've cut down instead.

There's a dozen reasons for it.

I have indeed had months where thanks to pipe making, I was able to pay my mortgage. This is great, but the pipemaking was a LOT less fun, and when you are either making commissions or just building "spec" pipes, you are saying to yourself the whole time "JEESUS I hope this sells!"

I see a future where smoking is illegal or close to it, and tobacco-related items will be taxed heavily or entirely frowned upon. So to me, getting into this market full-time right now is a silly venture, because it's not guaranteed to be there in 10 or 20 years.

The other big factor is that where I live is very expensive, and I can't make enough money at pipes unless I work like crazy. But a good day of making counter-tops or installing windows pays probably 3 times what a good day at pipe making does.

For me, it's a lovely hobby, I enjoy every aspect of pipes and pipe making. I make what I make, do it how I do it, and it's all good enough and lots of fun and it puts a tiny bit of money in the bank once in awhile to boot. But I think unless I see radical changes in the economy and wind up moving somewhere cheaper to live, I'd be insane to try this full time.

[PremalChheda]

If you want to make money, QUIT NOW before its too late!

[RadDavis]

If you want to make money, QUIT NOW before its too late!

Rad

[PremalChheda]

If you want to make money, QUIT NOW before its too late!

For real tho. If you are serious about making pipes for an income or to supplement your income, the best thing to do is first just make pipes, experiment to get better and learn, make plans, and track your progress. Get feedback from other pipemakers (not customers, unless you just want praise) Once you have a sale-able consistent product that is priced correctly, start selling through a website you create, dealers, social media, pipe shows. If you are having a hard time figuring out how to file for taxes, get an accountant, but if you keep good records, the taxes should not be too difficult to figure out in your locality. The biggest mistake would be not to make mistakes or avoid mistakes early on because when you make them later it hurts more. If you do some research on this forum alone, you will find a nearly endless amount of information that will help guide you and once you have exhausted the grand resources of pipemakersforum you can do a little more research about business and tooling on the web. You can also talk to other pipemakers but the information you are looking for in your post can mostly be found on this forum.

[LatakiaLover]

If you want to make money, QUIT NOW before its too late!

For real tho. If you are serious about making pipes for an income or to supplement your income, the best thing to do is first just make pipes, experiment to get better and learn, make plans, and track your progress. Get feedback from other pipemakers (not customers, unless you just want praise) Once you have a sale-able consistent product that is priced correctly, start selling through a website you create, dealers, social media, pipe shows. If you are having a hard time figuring out how to file for taxes, get an accountant, but if you keep good records, the taxes should not be too difficult to figure out in your locality. The biggest mistake would be not to make mistakes or avoid mistakes early on because when you make them later it hurts more. If you do some research on this forum alone, you will find a nearly endless amount of information that will help guide you and once you have exhausted the grand resources of pipemakersforum you can do a little more research about business and tooling on the web. You can also talk to other pipemakers but the information you are looking for in your post can mostly be found on this forum.

The most to-the-point advice in this thread, I think, and spot-on.

All that's left is the doing, cmueller.