pipemakersforum.com

BobR,
Didn't mean to step on your post. We're thinking alike.
Chas.

Firstly a question to walt, how are those buffs attached to the arbour? Is it threaded?

Now to help others here, I stand by my opinion that the best and affordable setup for buffing and or sanding is to invest the money in a small variable speed (not step pulley) wood lathe. With this you can run sanding pads in the headstock then when you buff you make a long arbour from threaded rod and support the other end in your tailstock. I first saw this idea from Steve (smokingdawg) I believe and it got my stamp of approval, so much in fact that when I came to upgrade my own buffing system this was what I chose, it was cheaper to buy a decent 1hp lathe and the parts to make the arbours than it was to buy just a 3phase motor and inverter. Actually maching the arbours took no more than a couple of hours and aside from a few modifications I have made for efficiency it has been running smoothly for several years. Plenty of power from 1hp, I run four 12"x1" buffs with no trouble.

oklahoma red wrote:BobR,
We're thinking alike.
Chas.

That's what I was thinking.

caskwith wrote:Firstly a question to walt, how are those buffs attached to the arbour? Is it threaded?

Now to help others here, I stand by my opinion that the best and affordable setup for buffing and or sanding is to invest the money in a small variable speed (not step pulley) wood lathe. With this you can run sanding pads in the headstock then when you buff you make a long arbour from threaded rod and support the other end in your tailstock. I first saw this idea from Steve (smokingdawg) I believe and it got my stamp of approval, so much in fact that when I came to upgrade my own buffing system this was what I chose, it was cheaper to buy a decent 1hp lathe and the parts to make the arbours than it was to buy just a 3phase motor and inverter. Actually maching the arbours took no more than a couple of hours and aside from a few modifications I have made for efficiency it has been running smoothly for several years. Plenty of power from 1hp, I run four 12"x1" buffs with no trouble.

If i did it over i would go this route too. If you use the beall arbor you can use the J. Alan sanding discs in the same arbor as the buffs, they use the same threaded shaft. They are pretty quickly changed. I have the Beall 3 on mandrill and it is tough to buff most pipes without accidentally touching another buff with the stem and ripping the pipe out of your hand. When I finally get a metal lathe I will use the old wood lathe strictly for buffing/sanding station with the quick change arbor and keep 4 or 5 buffs and 4 or 5 J. Alan sanding discs.

oklahoma red wrote:Here's another approach: unless you're married to the idea of multiple wheels on a single shaft consider a single motor with a variable speed drive to do it all, rough shape, finish sand, buff, stir your drinks, whatever. One good vacuum set up does it all too. Unless you are making a LOT of pipes it is not a big deal in my opinion to switch between functions. With the right arbor attached to the motor shaft the various discs and buffs can be switched in seconds. I use 5 different buffs, three for the compounds, one for wax and one for a dry buff/polish if needed. All the wheels are the same size with leather centers. I have a tapered buffing mandrel for the motor shaft and the wheels spin on and off of it in the blink of an eye. This setup takes up less space and less expense than having a whole line of dedicated motors and a complex vacuum system that has outlets at every station. Sure it's convenient to have all your buffing wheels lined up on the same shaft or a whole row of motors going down a wall of your shop but is it really necessary for low volume work?
No belts, no pulleys, no muss, no fuss.
Chas.

Oklahoma red,
Really even if you are doing a fair volume. Switching wheels shouldn't be bad. Specially if you work I'm batches. After watching the beall videos I thought one motor would be fine.


Sent from my banana phone.

BobR wrote:
Alex, why do you want the system described above? What's wrong with using the Beall arbor the way it was meant to be used? Just swap out the wheels. I think it offers more flexibility and you can add a variable frequency drive in the future to control speed. I just don't see the benefit unless you spend a lot of time buffing. I don't think you'll like that sanding setup either.

I was hoping to have everything in one setup so I wouldn't have to change any wheels. Also, with the step pulleys set up like this, I could get three speeds for sanding, buffing, and waxing. However, after reading the responses here, I'm realizing that it's a needlessly spacy setup, especially since where I plan on setting this up is not my own space, but the scene shop I work at.

I was considering a new set up such as this. It still has the 3-step pulleys, but skimps over the pillow blocks.



However, this wood lathe idea has me intrigued... something like this?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Shop-Fox-W1704- ... 1134665790

Once again, thank you all so much for chipping in your ideas

Best,
Alex

caskwith wrote:Firstly a question to walt, how are those buffs attached to the arbour? Is it threaded?

I positioned a locking collar on each side of a wheel, used a long clamp to squeeze them together with the buff in-between, tightened the set screws in the locking collars, and released the clamp!

Alex, I bet for the same money as the two step pulleys and the value of your time to set up and maintain this you could rock a variable speed setup and be much happier and be the envy of all the stage builder.


Sent from my banana phone.

BobR wrote:

WCannoy wrote:

BobR wrote:
Walt, you said "had". I think it would be beneficial to Alex to explain why it's not "have".

Maybe not so beneficial an explanation... At one point, I had to sell my workshop and everything in it.

Do you think there is any benefit to the average non-professional pipe maker having such a setup? You don't have a similar set up now ... why not? Specifically, are there technical reasons you chose not to repeat your old setup?

Well, at the time, it wasn't easy or cheap to get those bearings, shaft, and pulleys. I don't know how many folks remember the state of e-commerce around 2000 or so, but you couldn't just pop on the internet and find exactly what you needed all the time. I don't remember any of the big industrial supply houses having retail operations on the web... I had to go to my local Miller Bearing for the materials, and was charged a premium! But I pressed on with the project because I thought it would be very cool and professional to have a big row of different buffing wheels and such.

When I considered setting up this configuration for my new workshop, I remembered the expense, and the fact that I rarely used most of the crap that I set up on that rig.

Now, for the past two years, I have been using a cheap ass buffer from HF... 3600rpm with 6 inch wheels. One wheel for white diamond and one wheel for wax. It was all I could afford on the shoestring budget I was working with to set my shop back up. It took some finesse and patience to make that setup work, but it did the job:



Fortunately, this year's Chicago show went well for me, and gave me the chance to upgrade my buffer again!

So last week I installed this monster from Grizzly, a 1hp 1725 rpm with 9in. wheels. I'm pretty proud of her! I've tested it out on a couple of shop pipes, and it makes quick and easy work of putting a shine on briar and stems!



I think I'll be good on buffing equipment for a while...

One thing to remember when doing an all-in-one set up, where you have buffs on one axis and a sanding disc perpendicular to that, is to think of where in the shop you're going to use it. Because of the configuration, it won't always be practical.

These are all very good reasons. I'm pretty certain about the motor/wood lathe idea now, for the ease of setup. Just can't decide between wood lathe or electric motor... I know this goes back to "price wars", but do you think a super entry-level wood lathe is worth it over a motor half the price, or is it only worth going the wood lathe route if you spend a little more? I wouldn't mind spending up to ~$200 on the motor aspect, but I probably can't go any higher.

Thanks again!
-Alex

For years I used my drill press as my buffing wheel. Then I switched to my lathe, and I am still using that. It doesn't take up any more room than tools already in the shop, and with the lathe I have variable speed from 50 - 3000 rpm. I pretty much had that with the drill press too, but it is faster and easier to change both the buffing wheels and the speed on the lathe. I hold the Beall quick change arbor or whatever it is called in my scroll chuck and it all works real well together.

DeflictedPipes wrote:As a beginner with very similar goals I went with a 1/2hp Enclosed Grizzly motor, the Beall setup, and an arbor from Kurt that I can use to mount normal sanding disks (the Beall won't do that). It's working fantastic in my limited experience. I have a duct in the front I can attach to my Shop-vac, and I just spin it around a bit when I buff to get a comfortable angle.

Mike,

I've got my motor set up in pretty much an identical format (thank you for the idea!) and now I have a quick question regarding the shop vac scoop. How's the dust collecting capability with that scoop? If it is good, what's the HP on your shop vac? I ask because there's a 5 or 6 hp shop vac lying about and I'm wondering if it will move enough air to actually capture the majority of the dust with a scoop that large. I went to the window sill near my station today and saw that it was coated with a more-than-just-fine layer of briar dust

Thanks!
-Alex