PremalChheda wrote:If done correctly, staining with a vacuum chamber works very well, but you need proper equipment. Home use and light commercial equipment will not produce great results.
In looking at the instagram pic it looks like a vacuum casting setup. Would that be correct? I am considering a commercially made vacuum chamber made for use in stabilizing wood. Would this be substantial enough or is the vacuum needed more substantial?
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I have a turntex vacuum stabilizing chamber and can get a 95% or better vacuum. Not sure which one you are looking into but I know the turntex ones are capable of handling a lot.
It also looks like in the Instagram pic the stain my be applied and then the stummel put into the chamber and vacuum applied. Typically vacuum dying, for stabilization, is done by submerging the piece in the liquid and applying vacuum. When the vacuum is released, the solution is pulled into the material where the air got pulled out of it. Applying the stain to the stummel instead of submerging it would solve the problem of dye in the bowl but the alcohol based dyes will dry too quickly to have this work, I would think.
Anybody can become a woodworker, but only a Craftsmen can hide his mistakes!
-Walter Blodget
PremalChheda wrote:If done correctly, staining with a vacuum chamber works very well, but you need proper equipment. Home use and light commercial equipment will not produce great results.
In looking at the instagram pic it looks like a vacuum casting setup. Would that be correct? I am considering a commercially made vacuum chamber made for use in stabilizing wood. Would this be substantial enough or is the vacuum needed more substantial?
Sent from my HTC0P3P7 using Tapatalk
I have a turntex vacuum stabilizing chamber and can get a 95% or better vacuum. Not sure which one you are looking into but I know the turntex ones are capable of handling a lot.
It also looks like in the Instagram pic the stain my be applied and then the stummel put into the chamber and vacuum applied. Typically vacuum dying, for stabilization, is done by submerging the piece in the liquid and applying vacuum. When the vacuum is released, the solution is pulled into the material where the air got pulled out of it. Applying the stain to the stummel instead of submerging it would solve the problem of dye in the bowl but the alcohol based dyes will dry too quickly to have this work, I would think.
Especially if the dye was in the vacuum. It would dry faster that at atmospheric pressure.
Could you use this as almost a reverse contrast blast coloration technique? I don't see benefit for smooth work, but for blast work you might get some interesting effects.
PremalChheda wrote:If done correctly, staining with a vacuum chamber works very well, but you need proper equipment. Home use and light commercial equipment will not produce great results.
In looking at the instagram pic it looks like a vacuum casting setup. Would that be correct? I am considering a commercially made vacuum chamber made for use in stabilizing wood. Would this be substantial enough or is the vacuum needed more substantial?
Sent from my HTC0P3P7 using Tapatalk
I have a turntex vacuum stabilizing chamber and can get a 95% or better vacuum. Not sure which one you are looking into but I know the turntex ones are capable of handling a lot.
It also looks like in the Instagram pic the stain my be applied and then the stummel put into the chamber and vacuum applied. Typically vacuum dying, for stabilization, is done by submerging the piece in the liquid and applying vacuum. When the vacuum is released, the solution is pulled into the material where the air got pulled out of it. Applying the stain to the stummel instead of submerging it would solve the problem of dye in the bowl but the alcohol based dyes will dry too quickly to have this work, I would think.
As with stabilizing wood the process is like squeezing a sponge under water and releasing it. So as mentioned a water based vegetable dye is the thing to use as it won't dry out like alcohol based. Awesome, thanks!
PremalChheda wrote:If done correctly, staining with a vacuum chamber works very well, but you need proper equipment. Home use and light commercial equipment will not produce great results.
In looking at the instagram pic it looks like a vacuum casting setup. Would that be correct? I am considering a commercially made vacuum chamber made for use in stabilizing wood. Would this be substantial enough or is the vacuum needed more substantial?
Sent from my HTC0P3P7 using Tapatalk
I have a turntex vacuum stabilizing chamber and can get a 95% or better vacuum. Not sure which one you are looking into but I know the turntex ones are capable of handling a lot.
It also looks like in the Instagram pic the stain my be applied and then the stummel put into the chamber and vacuum applied. Typically vacuum dying, for stabilization, is done by submerging the piece in the liquid and applying vacuum. When the vacuum is released, the solution is pulled into the material where the air got pulled out of it. Applying the stain to the stummel instead of submerging it would solve the problem of dye in the bowl but the alcohol based dyes will dry too quickly to have this work, I would think.
The Turntex is what I'm looking at. What kind of pump do you pull a vacuum with? Does the 51/2" cube space hinder you in any way?
socrates wrote:
The Turntex is what I'm looking at. What kind of pump do you pull a vacuum with? Does the 51/2" cube space hinder you in any way?
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I have the US General 2 stage 3 CFM vacuum pump from harbor freight. It works well for the little bit I do. I've not found any real issues with the size of the chamber but I don't typically do big stuff. If you look at his site, there are quite a few options and I'm sure he can make custom sizes if you need it. Curtis Seebeck is the owner and makes all of the chambers himself. Really nice guys and will happily guide you through the options he can do, just give him a call. He likes to discuss the stuff over the phone.
andrew wrote:How much vacuum is needed? I'm thinking in psi.
andrew
Vacuum is actually measured in inches of mercury (Hg) in the US. Theoretical max vacuum is 29.92 in Hg at 59 degrees at sea level. The max drops about 1" for every 1000' above sea level. I am at 300' or so and can pull somewhere between 28.5" and 29", pretty close to 95% vacuum. The larger the vessel, the longer it will take to reach full vacuum.
There's lots of more detailed (and more accurate) info on Curtis' website, www.turntex.com. Top notch products and service too.
Anybody can become a woodworker, but only a Craftsmen can hide his mistakes!
-Walter Blodget
socrates wrote:
The Turntex is what I'm looking at. What kind of pump do you pull a vacuum with? Does the 51/2" cube space hinder you in any way?
Sent from my HTC0P3P7 using Tapatalk
I have the US General 2 stage 3 CFM vacuum pump from harbor freight. It works well for the little bit I do. I've not found any real issues with the size of the chamber but I don't typically do big stuff. If you look at his site, there are quite a few options and I'm sure he can make custom sizes if you need it. Curtis Seebeck is the owner and makes all of the chambers himself. Really nice guys and will happily guide you through the options he can do, just give him a call. He likes to discuss the stuff over the phone.
andrew wrote:How much vacuum is needed? I'm thinking in psi.
andrew
Vacuum is actually measured in inches of mercury (Hg) in the US. Theoretical max vacuum is 29.92 in Hg at 59 degrees at sea level. The max drops about 1" for every 1000' above sea level. I am at 300' or so and can pull somewhere between 28.5" and 29", pretty close to 95% vacuum. The larger the vessel, the longer it will take to reach full vacuum.
There's lots of more detailed (and more accurate) info on Curtis' website, http://www.turntex.com. Top notch products and service too.
Thanks! I was just ready to pull the trigger on the chamber and a Mastercool pump (3cfm). I'll go to the website first though. You have been so much help and I thank you. One more question, what depth of penetration have you been experiencing in briar? OK one more question do you use DyeRite clothes dye? I believe that's a veggy based water soluable dye. Thanks
socrates wrote:
Thanks! I was just ready to pull the trigger on the chamber and a Mastercool pump (3cfm). I'll go to the website first though. You have been so much help and I thank you. One more question, what depth of penetration have you been experiencing in briar? OK one more question do you use DyeRite clothes dye? I believe that's a veggy based water soluable dye. Thanks
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I haven't actually dyed any briar with the chamber. I have used it for stabilizing pen blanks and knife scales with Curtis' cactus juice and I am very pleased with the results. I used the alumilite dyes he sells and have gotten full penetration in 7/8" square pen blanks. Most pipes are well thinner than this before they are dyed.
For pipes I have only used fiebengs dye but not in the vacuum chamber. I would guess you will get good penetration with a mostly shaped stummel. I might have to try some out to see what the dyed briar looks like.
I might also look up the light fastness of the vegetable based dyes. I know a bunch of natural dyes (walnut husks, pokeberries) tend to fade over time, especially when in sunlight.
Anybody can become a woodworker, but only a Craftsmen can hide his mistakes!
-Walter Blodget
socrates wrote:
Thanks! I was just ready to pull the trigger on the chamber and a Mastercool pump (3cfm). I'll go to the website first though. You have been so much help and I thank you. One more question, what depth of penetration have you been experiencing in briar? OK one more question do you use DyeRite clothes dye? I believe that's a veggy based water soluable dye. Thanks
Sent from my HTC0P3P7 using Tapatalk
I haven't actually dyed any briar with the chamber. I have used it for stabilizing pen blanks and knife scales with Curtis' cactus juice and I am very pleased with the results. I used the alumilite dyes he sells and have gotten full penetration in 7/8" square pen blanks. Most pipes are well thinner than this before they are dyed.
For pipes I have only used fiebengs dye but not in the vacuum chamber. I would guess you will get good penetration with a mostly shaped stummel. I might have to try some out to see what the dyed briar looks like.
I might also look up the light fastness of the vegetable based dyes. I know a bunch of natural dyes (walnut husks, pokeberries) tend to fade over time, especially when in sunlight.
Whether it's safe on/in a pipe or not RitDye makes a Sun stabilizer for items dyed with their products. Perhaps it would stabilize natural dyes. I have used onion skins as a natural dye and it worked great. I reckon I'll need to do research into natural dyes. RitDye can and is used for home anodizing of aluminum so it's pretty versital stuff. LOL
