#19 - Second Billiard Attempt - feedback appreciated

[RickB]

As mentioned in my other thread, I've decided that for the foreseeable future I'll be building pipes in pairs: one billiard for learning and one 'fun' one to try to better satisfy my creative urges while I try to mimic the shapes I see online and in my head. Here's the billiard. My self critique is below - I'll point out the specific things that I know I struggled with - hopefully this will let you guys know where I know I've missed the mark so you don't have to waste time repeating things.
As with the other thread, sorry that the pictures are garbage.








The Good:
1. This was my first time hitting the airway perfectly centered.
2. Looks much closer to being a billiard than my previous effort.
3. Bite zone proper thickness and I did a better job of getting it flatter and non-footballish.
4. Finish in general is worlds better than the last one. Amazing what a difference it makes not doing all buffing and waxing at 3500 RPMs

The Bad:
1. I needed more off the chin and back of the bowl. I undershot the chin a fair bit because I tried a thinner oval shank this time, and visually pushing the shape a little more brandy-ish looked right at the time.
2. Taper on the underside of the stem bulges/blimps out a little.
3. As with the other one, quality of the polish on the stem is not yet where it needs to be.
4. The shank and stem taper toward the button instead of being proper straight lines (which would have put the button at ~17mm wide - big but still okay I think?)

The Ugly:
1. This was the first stem I drilled on the lathe, and the bit bent and wandered when I was drilling for the tenon - so it ended up too big, so the tenon was a little off center, so the airway is a little off-center. It's so terrible that I'm not including a picture.
2. As with the other one, the button is huge - and worse, I cut the slot a little off-angle. I tried to open it up a bit to even it out, but the internals are off and now the slot is huge and shitty looking.
3. There's something sort of funky with the taper down to the bite zone - I tried to pay attention to all my glare lines but I don't think I got things even enough as the cross-sectional shape changed to get down flat.

And just because I'm a smartass - here's my attempt at a pre-emptive LL/Sas'd side view shot:


Thanks again as always, everyone.

[sandahlpipe]

The bowl is about 1/8" too tall. There appears to be a gap between shank and stem, likely because the shank face isn't smooth. The stem itself appears to bulge right as it interfaces the shank. Get yourself a 3" long straight edge and make the stem dead straight on top and bottom from the shank face to the button. You have the same bulge here as on the other stem. Hold a pillar file askew to shape the stem. The middle of the bite area should be flat and only the outer edges should round over. You don't want a round cross-section behind the button.

The stem itself is about 1/2" too long. The bowl shape is pretty much right on. The stem appears to have a slightly flat spot right up by the shank.

What's really good is that you get the general idea of how the billiard bowl should be (and I wouldn't change anything about the bowl profile) The rest is details that come after you've gotten the right idea. I can't quite tell from the pictures, but it appears that the bottom 1/3 of the bowl isn't consistently round. Shaping the bottom of the bowl and not getting any lumps is a challenge that takes quite a bit of time to meet.

[RickB]

Thanks Jeremiah - I definitely still struggle with the stems quite a bit. I get a little bit gunshy right around the shank because I'm scared of clipping the end of the shank and messing up the profile there. Behind the button on this one is a lot flatter than the last one, but I'll take it further on the next. Shank face is okay, but the tenon being wonky messed things up there a bit for sure. I'll do my best to implement this stuff on the next one. Thank you again so much for your help and feedback.

[LatakiaLover]

It's tough to illustrate pipe line-holding with enlarged photos because an object's edges get softened/blurred by The Evil Pixel Software and waviness gets compensated for, but this should get the idea across.

Bottom line: Until your eye develops and you don't need it anymore, check all supposed-to-be-straight pipe lines with a small machined straight edge against a back light. (Something stiff and guaranteed straight, anyway. Unless thick & rigid, rulers don't work well because the flex messes with all kinds of stuff when trying to spot light gaps.)

[RickB]

Bottom line: Until your eye develops and you don't need it anymore, check all supposed-to-be-straight pipe lines with a small machined straight edge against a back light. (Something stiff and guaranteed straight, anyway. Unless thick & rigid, rulers don't work well because the flex messes with all kinds of stuff when trying to spot light gaps.)

Noted. I'd been using a razor as an ersatz straight edge, and it's both too short and probably too flexible. I ought to order some decent ones at some point, but do have a heavy ruler I can use in the interim. Thank you!

[sandahlpipe]

I use a small machinist square for the smaller places and a 6" steel rule for the longer lines. Also, sand the stem with a flat edge when you're done filing. I made myself a stem tool out of a hardwood scrap. It's flat on both sides with a very small radius on the front for sanding in the crease behind the button. The other side has a wider radius that I use to sand the saddle. You've gotta be pretty amazing to get a perfectly flat surface without a flat reference.

[RickB]

I think I've got an idea of what that tool looks like, but a picture would definitely help, if you've got one and don't consider it proprietary or anything.

[DocAitch]

I use a small machinist square for the smaller places and a 6" steel rule for the longer lines.

A piece of 3x5" card stock is adequate. If you are mashing hard enough to deform that, you are using way too much force.
These can also be trimmed to any size you want, and are easily replaceable, AND you can write on them for any notes that you may take.
DocAitch

[LatakiaLover]

I use a small machinist square for the smaller places and a 6" steel rule for the longer lines.

A piece of 3x5" card stock is adequate. If you are mashing hard enough to deform that, you are using way too much force.
These can also be trimmed to any size you want, and are easily replaceable, AND you can write on them for any notes that you may take.

Force isn't the problem, it's getting a narrow edge to be exactly axially aligned on a round/curved surface, plus the problems introduced by flexibility/deflection.

[RickB]

Force isn't the problem, it's getting a narrow edge to be exactly axially aligned on a round/curved surface, plus the problems introduced by flexibility/deflection.

Back when I was a luthier's apprentice, we had a great little set of straight edges for fretwork from StewMac. Looks like they've abadoned those in favor of the fret rocker - which maybe that would be worth me giving a look. http://www.stewmac.com/Luthier_Tools/Ty ... ocker.html

[LatakiaLover]

I think you'd find that fret rocker is still too thin (blade like), and that getting it aligned while simultaneously sighting for light gaps would be difficult. A tiny amount of rotation---remember you're trying to holding the pipe and reference tool in perfect axial alignment AND contact while at eye level AND "aimed" at a specific patch of white somewhere in front of you---torpedoes everything. And even when you're MOSTLY sure, the "never quite sure it was straight" feeling makes you check again and again. Very frustrating.

A wider flat surface makes the exercise stupid-easy and 100% reliable, though:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00UF ... HGC4NSM6WF