pipemakersforum.com

Wasn't sure which of the forums to put this on so forgive me if this should be elsewhere.
Q:
Do or have any of you started the pipemaking process with the entire briar burl?
Typically the ones I have and have access to are from 2-5 pounds, a bit smaller than a volleyball , larger than a cantaloupe.. and have a small portion of the briar-heather tree trunck, the knobby-scaly-twisty roundish burl and are then cut where the roots begin.

They are all air dried over 10 years, but from the dust and dirt and sand in the crannies, I don't think they have been 'boiled' as I have read is the treatment for briar burls initially before drying-seasoning and cutting into blanks for ebauchons or plateaus.They show few if any drying cracks or checks even on the old cut-off surfaces where cut wood was exposed.

Now, I have made several nice plateau freehands from one such burl( with enough for about four more pipes yet to be used) , with no boiling-leaching of the briar.
The wood is stable, hard, and they are smoking very well.
The wood is worked at an MC of 7-10% and has been there for months.

What is the purpose of boiling briar we read of?

In all my other woodworking endeavors, soaking wood in water or boiling is not used as it leaches out color, strength and much of the beauty of the wood.
What is removed by boiling would be the resins, lignins and cellular proteins which were the life of the wood, but harden in the heartwood and when dead-dried, become fairly solid.
Can someone explain the purpose of boiling briar burl-root chunks prior to cutting?
Is this a practice used in antiquity to keep the wood from drying irregularly, replacing much of the wood's 'life' with more free water which can escape during the drying?

I am curiousand hope someone can shed some light on this for me.Best regards, Jim
and yes, I am new to this forum with all it's talented passionate crafters , but not new to pipes nor pipe smoking..

Here is a page from Romeo Briar. View the top heading "PROCESS".

http://www.romeobriar.com/main.html

Hi Jim,

The mills dry the burls in a moist environment, keeping them damp so that they don't split from drying too fast.

The blocks are boiled for something like 12 hours *after* cutting to remove tannins and sap from the wood to give it as neutral a taste as possible.

I don't think anyone boils whole burls before cutting.

Rad

Rano & Rad, Thanks for the replies and the link.

I'm familiar with "retarding" moisture loss in denser hardwoods of thick dimensions so the wood can lose moisture with inner cells keeping better pace with the outer.
Damp and cool and dark are usually the steps where no modern process and instrumentation for it's control are available.

From what I have experienced so far with the burl I have worked, that process was successfully done.
The burls arrived in import some 15 years ago , packed in damp sawdust in heavy wet burlap bags.
They resided in those bags for over three years in a 60F ambient where the average RH was around 60-70%.( 60% RH equates to an MC of about 11-12% IF the wood object is allowed to reside there long enough and for thick pieces, it can take more than a few years.They are in a barrel presently but the same ambient temp and RH..

Concerning the boiling of the blocks as an initial stage on green cut briar from the burl-root ball:

Is this to improve the smoking properties ( taste-aroma/nose) for the finished pipe or a remedial step in the drying process done as a tradition by crafters to lessen the cracking and checking thick chunks of dense wood can experience??or perhaps both?
I have, and do, smoke many dozens of briar pipes ( briar from six or seven different countries of origin, made by nearly 100 different crafters/companies over 100 years) and for the life of me, IF the pipe was well designed when made and decently broken in, I've never detected much difference in any of them which can be traced to the briar wood.
Air passage and draft subtleties, how they have been broken in, cleaned and smoked yes, but pipe shape?..the briar itself? I cannot ,measure that at all in my 40 some years as pipe smoker.Perhaps every pipe maker or pipe company used the same or similar techniques over 2 centuries..

The 'bitterness' spoken of from the wood's oils and tannin-like cellular stuff which the boiling of the blocks reduces....does that show up in tongue bite?nose aromas ? tobacco burning temperature? IF the blocks are not boiled but theey were allowed to season, lose weight-moisture over time and proper ambient?

I guess there are some time honored and proven things about handling briar for pipes which run quite counter to all my experiences cutting, handling, seasoning and working with hardwoods for other fine items over the years..I would never subject a piece of hardwood for making fine furniture, clocks, musical instruments or archery longbows to boiling.. so I am learning something new with this treatment of the briar blocks.

Parting question:
IF the briar burls ARE seasoned over ten years and NOW cut into blocks for pipes..will the boiling have the same benefit or even be required?
Lot's to ponder..Jim

A few years ago I got a shipment of briar that was improperly processed - minimal boiling, poor drying conditions, you name it. Among the obvious flaws, like checks, cracks, and twisting of the block, there was also the taste of the wood. When I tell you it was some of the most foul stuff I had ever had the displeasure of smoking, I kid you not. It was bitter, tannic, acrid, and just downright unpleasant. I know a couple guys got wood from this same supplier, and had the same opinion.

So in my experience, yes - boiling matters. It also is the way briar has been processed for pipes for the better part of this century at least.

Now, if a 150 year old briar pipe, that was made from briar not boiled and processed as is modern, but has been smoked fairly regularly, doesn't taste like the Southern end of a Northbound mule, it's probably due to being broken in a lifetime or more ago and had the demons of unpleasantness exercised from it. Could time itself lessen the effects? I don't know. I'm not old enough to have carried out that particular experiment. Ask Rad.

KurtHuhn wrote:Could time itself lessen the effects? I don't know. I'm not old enough to have carried out that particular experiment. Ask Rad.

Kurt, Thanks for the experience..You have an admirable talent and a great willingness to help and share with others.A gift!

One cannot help but wonder what the 'water' may have been like used to boil that poor batch from which your experience came.

Boiling water is..well ...pretty constant in temperature.. so it may have been the duration of the boil?

Polluted water which left acidic or alkaline or mineral ( or worse) residue in the briar wood?
Cook brocoli or snap peas in polluted water, drain and eat them..the water does make a difference as some of it, with whatever impurities it contains, is absorbed..detectable even after dehydration or drying to 7% MC.
Tainting after the processing by air, sun, mold or whatever?
Hard to know I suppose.

Anyhow, I'm not presently planning on boiling any of the briar from the one burl I have left when I saw it further into ebauchons or plateaus for the next pipes.
Not even with distilled water..
The briar is so nicely seasoned and the initial pipe I made came out so well that I haven't the heart to subject the wood to it.

FWIW, the first pipe I made from the burl smokes very nicely, cool and smooth and even the finest fitment of stem to shank and measurements of bowl diameter haven't changed an iota since breaking in .Not a fill or a flaw nor crack or check..Perhaps I was just lucky..It has a simple oil finish only..polished by hand and waxed.

While I admire the pipemaking heritage, the families ( and entire towns )who have made wonderful pipes and produced stummels for many others over the years..at times I wonder IF some of the trade secrets and guild-like processes they have used over the years to differentiate theiir work from others may be a good part advertising hype designed to cloud good pipemaking with a mystical aura of sorts..from how truly simple it is..while having the potential for being a profound craft and art.

From the 50 year or older heather shrub in the rocks to the charm light over well packed good tobacco ..they do their best to make and sell their work and establish a reputation....so their work is more highly sought after and paid for.
Does the $1500.00 pipe made by a renowned house or artist smoke better than the 20.00 one?
Perhaps...but it is human nature to value those items one spends more for even when a simpler less expensive item would do as well...and few would boast to his fellows that their least expensive pipe was their go to smoker when they had such a pipe in the rack.
.
It would be an interesting experiment among descriminating pipe smokers to smoke many pipes of similar style without knowing who made them, when, or where...blindfolded, perhaps touching just the shank of the pipe...all with the smokers same. chosen tobacco.

A James Cooke? Edwards? Grabow? Mark Tinksley?

Over the years I have enjoyed smoking many fine pipes..Usually the time, place..perhaps the people present.. and setting ..with the good tobacco made the pipesmoke respite memorable and enjoyable...and I have had such smokes many hundreds of times with 6.00 pipes or 600.00 ones...from corncob pipes, clays, meerschaums, porcelains and many briars.I love them all..

For me, pipes are made to be smoked and enjoyed..With the making of one's own, there is an added dimension to that pleasure.

I am sometimes amazed at the highest dollar pipes, exquisitely done which pass on at auction or estate sale and have hardly if ever been smoked.
Of course I also see vintage firearms of the highest quality..designed for hunting, which have scarce been fired..let alone taken afield..Go figger..
Sorry for the rambling.I'm getting old and it's late..Jim

jim in Oregon wrote:Kurt, Thanks for the experience..You have an admirable talent and a great willingness to help and share with others.A gift!

One cannot help but wonder what the 'water' may have been like used to boil that poor batch from which your experience came.

Boiling water is..well ...pretty constant in temperature.. so it may have been the duration of the boil?

Polluted water which left acidic or alkaline or mineral ( or worse) residue in the briar wood?
Cook brocoli or snap peas in polluted water, drain and eat them..the water does make a difference as some of it, with whatever impurities it contains, is absorbed..detectable even after dehydration or drying to 7% MC.
Tainting after the processing by air, sun, mold or whatever?
Hard to know I suppose.

What I do know is based on my own experiences, and upon discussions with other folks that have boiled various woods to remove tannins, oils, etc. The most important part of this process is changing the water. If you boil, but never change the water, you reach a state of equilibrium with the various compounds, and you don't fully remove the stuff from the wood. You can see this with something as simple as salt pork - soak it in water to rehydrate it and you get salty water, but the pork is still salty. However, soak it in water and change that water every few hours for 12 hours, and the pork and water both have a reduced concentration of sodium. The same thing holds true for wood. Just plain boiling won't change much - it has to have the water cycled out as well. You can actually see the difference in the water. By the time you've changed the water for the 8th time, the color of the water is drastically different from the first time you swapped it out.

Where do you obtain whole burl briar? Is this stuff available to the general public? thanks, Scot

pennyscot, I sent you a PM on the briar burl source I know of.

Kurt,
Sounds like the boiling process would need to be attended closely..

One could surmise that when the water solution began to darken to some shade from clear, that water would either be added ( for the evaporation) ? or changed out ..so the lignins, proteins, etc oils (and I'd guess a fair amount of color) would be removed.
Many woods have been used to make dyes over the years..Osage orange for example was once used for a bright yellow dye for woolen garments..

Can't help but wonder on the destructive effects of boiling fluids in the cells of the wood and rupturing them..Certtainly wouldn't do that for any wood item which was required to have best flexural or tensile strength but perhaps wood for pipes has and can be subjected to the process and still be strong enough...tho maybe some of the broken shanks in finished pipes or breaks which occur in making pipes could be attributed to the process..
Thank you for the insights.

I still suspect that the traditional boiling of the green fresh cut briar blocks is more for facilitating drying ( replacing natural cellular moisture, oils, lignins etc with freer water for the drying) than for improving the taste of the smoke in the finished pipe..Jim

I would say best to use it as is and hope for the best. The burls you have are dry, rehydrating them is also going to stress the wood and the likelihood is that it will all crack when drying back out.

However, if you decide to boil them adding water won't cut it. The water needs to be brought up to a boil and the blocks transfered. Transferring the blocks to cold water will just stress the blocks more. The first 2 months the drying really needs to be retarded. Place the wood in plastic trash bags and control the exposure to dry air and constant checking. The slightest crack and close up the bag, it is drying too fast.

Actually I think it is cheaper and easier to just buy high quality processed blocks and skip all the aggravation, YMMV.