visiting a pipemakers shop...how to approach?

[loosvelt]

Hey guys,

I was wondering if the group would over me some advice on the most appropriate way a new hobbyist like myself asks a more experienced pipemaker if he can come down to his shop, observe, and maybe pick the makers brain a little bit?

Is it more appropriate to wait until I can make it to a pipe show where I can introduce myself in person, or can pleasant email or phone call be ok?

Last question. I am very very new to pipemaking, is it wiser or more appropriate to work on your own for a decent amount of time and churn out some pipes best you know how, or is it wiser to visit a maker early on in order to pick up the very basic proper techiques and lower the chances of developing bad habits? The reason I ask is I am in federal law enforcement and there were guys in my academy who never fired a handgun before the first day of class, and there were guys who were self taught, owned handguns and went to the range a couple times a month. Many many times the guys with no experienced ended up easily outshooting the guys with self-taught skills by the end of the academy. This was because the new guys employed proper technique from day one and had no bad habits to overcome.

Thanks in advance. With that said anybody have a shop a few hours from D.C. and willing to have a visitor? I can clean a shop and always buy the drinks after

[TRS]

I am in federal law enforcement

Just show up at their shop one day, with badge and gun. They'll be happy to let you sit in.

[KurtHuhn]

There's really no hard and fast rules. Just remember, it never hurts to ask.

[loosvelt]

I am in federal law enforcement

Just show up at their shop one day, with badge and gun. They'll be happy to let you sit in.

Haha, well the people I usually have to take this approach with don't really end up being very cordial with me, so I doubt it will work here.

There's really no hard and fast rules. Just remember, it never hurts to ask.

Yeah that's was I was thinking. Like the knifemaking community, most pipemakers seem pretty cool about helping the younger guys learn.

[T3pipes]

Badge flash will work. Say you are with ATF and doing research for a case you are working.

I also have 20 years in Law Enforcement, so I understand the shooting reference. Pipe making is not as hard to correct bad habits, as there is no muscle memory involved.

[loosvelt]

Badge flash will work. Say you are with ATF and doing research for a case you are working.

I also have 20 years in Law Enforcement, so I understand the shooting reference. Pipe making is not as hard to correct bad habits, as there is no muscle memory involved.

Good point

[Sasquatch]

I think if you approach a guy respectfully, and mindful that in essence you are wasting his time (in some ways... not in others!) for your own benefit, most guys would be very open to spending some time and doing some teaching. If I didn't live in the middle of nowhere and spend so much time leaving footprints in inaccessible places, I would certainly have bugged any number of guys on this board. But it's really not feasible for me because of where I live.

I do know that if anyone wanted to come and hang out in my shop some day, I'd be honored. I guess if a different guy every day wants to bug you, it might be different. But I'd guess that if you find a maker near you, he'd be happy to spend some time.

[SimeonTurner]

I agree with Kurt. It never hurt to ask, and most of the makers I have interacted with are really willing to lend advice/host a little visit.

[pennsyscot]

Is "Tradhunter" a reference to traditional archery?

[Tano]

I think it depends on who you approach. I would open my workshop to any pipe maker, either novice or master. But would the master do the same for me?

[loosvelt]

Is "Tradhunter" a reference to traditional archery?

Yeah it is, it is the only way to hunt....imo...

I really don't know why I used that name here, I'm actually going to ask kurt to switch my SN to my last name. I plan on being around for a while, and I think it would be better to switch now then later.

I haven't shot my trad bow much lately though. It seems I have to many hobbies .

[KurtHuhn]

I haven't shot my trad bow much lately though. It seems I have to many hobbies .

I have the best of both worlds. An Oneida Aero Force. Effing awesome bow, and I can't wait till spring to take out some rogue haybales.

[pennsyscot]

I have an ACS CX longbow. I love it. Nothing like picking a spot and trying to maintain your concentration while your knees are knocking and heart pounding. Traditional hunting is challenging, but it sure is sweet when everything comes together. I think it took me about 3 years before I became a good instinctive shot. Lookin forward to gettin out on the 3d ranges in the spring. Maybe you should keep the name, It's something to be proud of.

[Christopher Brunton]

Pipe making is not as hard to correct bad habits, as there is no muscle memory involved.

Not to get on the wrong side of the Law or anything but, like anything you do with your hands (or possibly other body parts), its (almost) all about muscle memory. Eyeball muscles included. Just an observation.

chris

[T3pipes]

I concede that there are repetitive tasks to pipe making that can lead to good and bad habits, but not to the extent were are speaking of when shooting. It was a bit of an over-generalization.

Nearly all aspects of marksmanship (such as stance, hand placement, target acquisition, sight picture, breathing, trigger pull, etc.) are centered around uniformity of action.

Even the repetitive aspects of pipe making have slight variations from pipe to pipe.

[loosvelt]

I haven't shot my trad bow much lately though. It seems I have to many hobbies .

I have the best of both worlds. An Oneida Aero Force. Effing awesome bow, and I can't wait till spring to take out some rogue haybales.

Kurt are we brothers? Pipes, Knives, Good Food, Bows.... if I ever move to RI we're going to have to hang out and shoot some arrows while smoking some miss-mud.

I do like the Oneidas, once you get them tuned right, and hopefully don't have problems with the steel cables, they shoot great. If you do like lever action bows, I would highly recommend taking a look at monster bows next time you need/want a new one. All the Oneida owners love them. The Dragon is the next non-trad bow I will buy. Check it out;

http://www.monsterbows.com/monster/Page7.html

I have an ACS CX longbow. I love it. Nothing like picking a spot and trying to maintain your concentration while your knees are knocking and heart pounding. Traditional hunting is challenging, but it sure is sweet when everything comes together. I think it took me about 3 years before I became a good instinctive shot. Lookin forward to gettin out on the 3d ranges in the spring. Maybe you should keep the name, It's something to be proud of.

I would love to have an ACS!!!! Sweet bow P-scott. . Can't afford one when I am trying to tool up the pipe shop though . I am more of a recurve guy myself. I am a horrible instinctive shot, I use a trad sighting system by 3rivers archery. One day when I can shoot more I will let go of this crutch.

[KurtHuhn]

http://www.monsterbows.com/monster/Page7.html

Oh, now that's dead sexy! WANT!

[Alan L]

Kurt, Kurt, Kurt....

I see I MUST get you into the true traditionalist mindset, and I don't mean olive-oiled lederhosen with a Robin Hood hat whilst strutting to Right Said Fred (I'm too sexy for my pipe!) either...

First off, the lederhosen must be greased with lard-oh, wait, I wasn't gonna go that way-
a-HEM! If'n a bow has more than one string it better be shootin' more than one arrow, much as the smilie following this sentance has a pair of 1911 A-1's:

I say this only as a concerned citizen who shoots a ca 1970 Fred Bear recurve but wants a nice osage longbow, you understand. The Bear is as old as me and both it and myself are having some delamination issues.

As a side note, what is this thing of which some of you speak regarding "sights" on bows? Have gravity and the wind ceased to exist? C'mon now, don't make me come up there and smack you... BE the arrow, grasshopper.

[KurtHuhn]

Truth be told, I've been shooting recurves and longbows since I was 12, and never had a sight on my bow. I have a Bear, that's also having delamination problems and like yours is a '70s model, so I don't shoot it anymore. But I also have a '70s PSE takedown recurve similar to the Martin Jaguar that's out now (also want). I used to be very, very good - no Byron Ferguson, but very good nonetheless. I had a no-name selfbow that I've lost somewhere in the last 15 years of moving around, and I'd love to have another.

Until I bought this Oneida I never really wanted sights on a bow. And I never really understood compound bows. Now I understand. I've got it setup for 70# and a draw length to fit my long-ass arms, and I can sit there and hold it on target all day if I need to. There's a huge difference between lining up on a target while holding 50#, and while holding somewhere around 10#.

But that doesn't mean I don't want another longbow. I just need to find some traditional bow maker that needs a new pipe or something.

[d6monk]

Sorry to change the subject again you guys, but I find this topic pretty interesting and some of what I've learned may be of help to trad:

I think I am getting pretty close to hitting the self-taught wall here and will have to find a professional pipe maker that would be willing to spend a little time with me. However, there are a number of reasons that I'm glad I have waited this long before visiting anyone.

First, I feel that after a little more than a year of making pipes I know it is something that I want to continue doing seriously. When you are just starting out you really don't know if you want to do this professionally, even if you think you do. I mean, you may find out that you really don't have the knack for it, or that you really can't take the nth hour of being alone sanding stems and stummels every day, or that you just get bored of it, or that you just want to make one pipe every couple of months as a hobby.

Also, after making so many pipes I have enough experience and understanding of the process to know what some of my weak points are, to be able to ask thoughtful questions, and it will be a lot easier to absorb and retain anything a pro would teach me. I would imagine that visiting a pipe maker after only a couple of pipes would be pretty overwhelming, and you would miss out on learning lots of the little intricacies that are really what you will need professional help with in the future. This forum has plenty of general information to get you started in the right direction and I think going at your own pace at the beginning is just what is needed.

As far as learning bad habits I wouldn't be too worried. What I have noticed improves the most is my ability to "see" what shapes, angles, proportions, etc. look good. Every pipe I make looks better than the one before it, and after a couple more pipes I will look back and see all kinds of things I would like to change--a taller bowl, a different angle on the rim, a steeper curve here, a more pronounced widening of the bowl here, etc. And every pipe it gets easier to see what things are not symmetrical or are "off" and fix them. I think this is something that just needs to be done to be learned (although I am not saying that other makers pointing things out would not help), and you can't really pick up any bad habits in this--unless maybe you are one of those people who love Castello 55s . Studying pipes of professional makers also helps a lot with this.

Anyway, hope this helps, just try not to get ahead of yourself.